unsure but feeling free

Title: unsure but feeling free
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Date Posted：25/10/2008 5:19 AMCopy HTML

My first post - not sure it warrants a new topic, though. Not sure what the correct protocol is there ... Maybe I should have called myself 'not sure'??

I walked away from RV last week after 31 years - yes, I can hardly believe that myself.

As my topic suggests, feeling very unsure but somehow liberated. Perhaps it's just the extra free time I have in a week ha ha.

Not funny, really, I know. I've been a full-on towing the line kinda gal for all this time.

Any suggestions on regaining my identity? I don't feel too bad, considering, but waver from feeling liberated to feeling about to be caught out.

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 5:30 AMCopy HTML

Congrats for making what is bound to be the right decision.  If you are like me and like most people who stepped out you will go through a cycle of emotions.  Take it easy, DON'T PANIC! Go easy on yourself, give yourself time.  Google is your friend.  There is a ton of stuff on this site and many others for advice in what to do now.  
Which assembly were you in?  I found personally that this site was immensely helpful to me.

And here I sit so patiently waiting to find out what price / I have to pay to get out of going through all these things twice

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 5:33 AMCopy HTML

I should have written RF - sorry. Sydney. I was there alone, my family long gone, but have received no 'I told you so's', which is good.

I'll be fine I'm sure - thanks for the NO PANIC suggestion. I've been reading this site now for about 5 days - found much to laugh at and cry at but mostly enjoying the banter of old friends ... bit like eavesdropping in a good way.

Where were you before you left?

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 6:03 AMCopy HTML

Hi, Theresa.

Where to for you, now? Are you interested in making sense of what happened to you in the RF? Of making sense of what biblical Christianity is all about? If so, you might like to visit www.pleaseconsider.info (shameless self-promotion I know, but Drew and I put that site together for people in your situation) 

Blessings,

Ian

email: didaktikon@gmail.com

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 6:47 AMCopy HTML

Thanks, Ian. I've been pretty impressed with your vast knowledge of all things scriptural, you and others like Moth and others.

I've found myself in this week looking to 'start again' in some ways. I'd really grown away from my own love of Jesus and just 'walked the walk' but felt so little of it.

I'm keen to read your shameless self-promoted site ... 

I'm a bit pleased that I didn't just fade away from RF, but made the relevant goodbyes (very difficult and tricky) but now feel I can move on.

Anyhow, blessings right back at you. Thanks for taking the time to reply to me.

Theresa

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 8:25 AMCopy HTML

spitchips,

No more sailing on "The Black Pearl", hey?  Now for the good adventures to begin.

Read Luke chapter15:........(Note V7) and see to whom it is referring to now. Jesus knows who His sheep are.

regards

brolga

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 9:42 AMCopy HTML

Oh, Brolga, you made me smile. I'm beginning to look forward to the new journey on the high seas, what?

I'll do as you suggest and get back to you.

For the record, I'm a bit miffed at myself for being stubborn so long and 'hanging in there' through thick and thin. 'Overcoming' it wasn't, just subborness. I finally feel like reading my bible to see what I should be doing.

I'm a lucky girl and I'm determined not to be resentful or to mourn the years lost, so much as run with the new energy I feel.

To think I may never have summoned the courage. I'm a bit proud of myself if I must be honest.

Will read Luke and remember who I am. I've always loved 'my sheep will hear my voice'. 

I'm hoping my steps will now be ordered by the Lord and no-one else, ah?

regards and blessings

Theresa

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 9:43 AMCopy HTML

Thanks so much for dropping in. Certainly and definitely worth a newtopic! To hear about you leaving that group after sooo many years...it's admirable and amazing. Enjoy the free time your weeks now allowyou to get to know yourself and the planet outside of the walls you'vebeen boxed in for so long. I hope you don't feel you need to 'rush'into another organisation or a group. You really need to de-frag yourmind and not try to fill the void, or even perhaps loneliness, thatcomes from coming out of a group that was so communal. There's no rush, despite their fearful warnings that 'The Lord is coming soon'. Let him come.

I'm sure your family is far too busy sighing with relief and happiness to think about 'I told you sos'.Mine were. It's great that you were able to say proper goodbyes tofriends at RF. That's some great closure that will enable a smoothtransition out of the system. No bad blood I hope, and RF members seemto not shun so aggressively as they used to. You might feel likethere's a feeling of disappointment from them towards you, but that'snormal and is their problem, not yours.

I've had a bad day, but hearing your story here, even briefly hasreally lifted my spirits. Thanks again and I hope to hear more from youas you go. If you do decide to stick around intermiitently here, trynot to get addicted to the forum :-P

Very cool. Moth.

Instagram and Twitter: @mothpete

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 9:51 AMCopy HTML

Hi Moth
Oh, I see how easily I could become addicted to this forum.  So instant and edgy ... I'll be careful.
Thank you for your kindness and I hope your day tomorrow is much better. Yep, it's the disappointment and the fallout I caused behind me that made me the saddest.
I'll not rush into anything - defraging is an understatement but I appreciate the analogy. 
I've read many posts between yourself, Ian and others - very amusing and disarmingly honest. I'm still a bit afraid that someone is gonna rap me over the knuckles (guess that will hang haunt me for a bit).
blessings 
Theresa

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 10:08 AMCopy HTML

 Heya

I think I stuck around for as long as I did in 'revival' land, dragging the chain like yourself, because I felt responsible for the souls of those who I felt looked up to me, and out of duty to the great learned men of the hierarchy (tongues in cheek). I felt irreplacable but it seems they were able to survive without me... and more's the pity - ha.

I also held onto an unhealthy fear of authority, but these shmucks (sorry about the name calling) do not have any authority over you or your life. These Egyptians, they're just men, they're not gods. They're just big fish in very very little ponds, but it must feel very daunting to be out in the ocean away from them. My mind is still boggling over the thought of realligning yourself to reality after 31 years. Were you born into it?

Instagram and Twitter: @mothpete

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 11:05 AMCopy HTML

Hi Moth

I'm not feeling too terrible - I do get what you say about authority, though. A phone call would make the old heart start a thumpin, I'm sure. It's daunting alright, but it's kind of exciting now and I will not beat myself up too much about time 'wasted'. 

Could be I'm in shock after just a week and it will hit all at once? 

I did have a lot of people looking up to me, for whatever reasons - sounds familiar when you put it that way.

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 12:21 PMCopy HTML

Reply to spitchips 


Hey Spitchips,
Great to read your post and even though you are a little unsure, you have an assuredness about you that I'm sure will guide you through. Your new found enthusiasm is a great way to start your new journey.
When we first left we were a bit in shock and I think also we felt almost a mourning for the life we left.
Now I mourn for the life we wasted being governed and oppressed by such insignificant gits. Talk about miss placed loyalties!!! 
So do you feel like a naughty school girl? At meeting times, do you feel like your skipping class and your gonna get busted? Consider yourself expelled, their authority is irrelevant to you now. Obedient to Christ not man.
Your working out your own salvation -no doubt with a little fear and trembling!! But it's your responsibility- not theirs.
It's a bit funny, how when we are grown up responsible adults but yet we gave so much credence to what the oversight said. 
For me it was almost feeling like a child needing my guardians approval, proving my worth, almost a validation if that makes any sense. 
I still struggle to believe that I allowed them that power and held them in such esteem and sad that I cast my pearls before such swine. When push came to shove they showed their true colours.
I wonder how much more effective for Christ we may have been had we been nurtured properly and allowed to give and grow.
Last Sunday was an Honour day for the volunteers that operate the food/clothing co-op at the church we are presently attending. I was in awe of the expression of Gods love in their works.
In retrospect we have led such a greedy, self seeking existence in the RC's we helped no one, well very few anyway, most times not even each other. We watched a video of people in need being ministered to, not just in receiving substance but also  giving ear to their plights, understanding and being treated with respect, some even taking comfort by having someone pray for whatever their troubles. The Rc's are so far away from the love of God to be able to Love your brother as yourself.
So Theresa, Welcome back into the world that God created for you to enjoy and not to be afraid of. The Rc world is an insular falsehood that has kept us not only separate to the world but separate from the fullness of being alive in Christ.
Our lights have been hidden under the Bushels called RCF/RCI. Shine on sister!

This site has often been a place of solace and comfort when others can't understand where I have come from.
Initially it was quite a life line for my family, some where to belong when I felt quite lost. Now at times it's a bit like a diary but with the ability of response- sometimes in the form of support, other times correction and the occasional antagonist.

Take what you need, give what you can and leave what you don't want- somebody else might want it!!

As I hear it, I'll repeat it, Its up to you if you believe it! Allegation big and small, soon revealed before us all. outa here- Outa Egypt!

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 1:07 PMCopy HTML

Hi Theresa
 
Firstly, welcome to the forum and welcome to the liberty of Christ. I loved hearing your story and would love to chat with you some more and get to know you. We're the same age and I was in RC/RF for 24 years before leaving almost 2 years ago. My husband, myself and our daughter & her husband all left together along with around 30 others from the Adelaide assembly. I did all the 'right' things and got to all the door knocks, coffee mornings, meetings etc etc but didn't really have a relationship with Jesus Christ - my relationship was with the organisation, amazing really! I look back now and see that it was all just 'works'.  I had no understanding for that whole time of the grace of God. 

A pastor at the church I attend nowadays has a saying 'the God you know is the God you show'. The rf only know a God of judgment, control, fear etc so that is all they're able to 'show'.  But praise God, I've come to know a God of mercy, love, grace, compassion and so very much more and THAT is what I am now able to show others. 

I'm so very very pleased to hear that you have left and that you have not been too wounded in doing so - many people hold on to bitterness against these groups and then that only ends up eating away at them. To be able to move on into the liberty that Jesus Christ has for us is a truly amazing journey and I wish you well in it.

Will talk again soon, God bless you & your family

Love, Urchin x x

Your unfailing love, O Lord, is as vast as the heavens; your faithfulness reaches beyond the clouds. Your righteousness is like the mighty mountains, your justice like the ocean depths.

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 5:35 PMCopy HTML

 Hi Theresa,

Welcome to the wider Christian community - and to freedom.  It's a big step to take after so many years. Your family must be overjoyed.

You know we just don't realise while in RF etc what an atmosphere of dependence has been created within those halls.  Breaking free, even though no-one bars the way, is not that easy and does take courage. 

I left 17 months ago and have no desire to return, although for the first few months I felt sad.  During these times I'd think of the frequent usage of certain words and sayings, chiches which I found tiresome, like "I just can't wait for the Lord's return" and others.  Well, I'm enjoying the wait and relying fully on the Lord Jesus while I'm waiting.  I am now the person God made me rather than the person I was expected to be according to RF.

Look forward to "hearing" from you again.

Joy and peace of the Lord be with you.

Epi

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：25/10/2008 11:24 PMCopy HTML

 Hi Theresa, I think I may know you.  Were you a bridesmaid at a wedding in 1982?

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：26/10/2008 9:07 AMCopy HTML

To Outer, Urchin and Epi

Thanks for your very insightful words ... mulling them over. Lots of consider there but i do recognise sincerity when I hear it!
To Heregoes
Not sure - so long ago. Maybe.
Spitchips

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：26/10/2008 9:53 PMCopy HTML

 Hey Spitchips, welcome to freedom and this site, like most on here we have found it usefull and challengeing. The best advice i had when I/we left was to sit back relax if you dont always understand something ask (so nice to ask without being told of) Anyway, your life has started another phase now one for good. I know the 1st christmas we had after years and years of xmas camps was a bit weird and of course what to do on new years eve was a question. Me and mrs earth took the time to still pray it in but in thanks to a new life and start in our journey.

Ian is correct in viewing please consider, it is most helpful in debunking revivalist myths and legends, and he is more that happy to answer questions for you.

Urchin, Epi i think will be most helpful to you in working through things, and there are many on here leading great lives that have much to consider and to advise you on.

I pray that your time now is fruitfull, and we all understand what you will be going through to some extent.

God Bless
earth5

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：27/10/2008 1:47 AMCopy HTML

Hi earth5

Ta for your wise words. I'll be taking some time to read 'please consider' - already been browsing. Not feeling very motivated/inspired to wrangle and I certainly don't feel any loyalties to anyone but my family right now. I am happy to sit back for a while and think. I'm glad Jesus knows what's going on, because I don't have much of a clue. 

My inclination is to be able to find somewhere to fellowship when I want to without the feeling of measuring up/not measuring up. My 'slide' to the outside world has been a bit gradual ... I found myself more and more enjoying the company of 'real' people .... guess that's where this all started. 

After this week/10 days I'm still wondering about my own reaction when someone 'follows' me up, which is inevitable. I don't want to be cruel to anyone - I've got genuine friends in RF and they all want to have coffee and chat when I'm ready. 

Re-reading the above, I realise that I'm more caught up right now with what people are thinking rather than my own future. I'll get over it ... scuse the whinge.

I feel like a need a week to sit at my computer and read indepth, with no distractions, all that debunks what I've been taught for so long.

I appreciate you praying for me because I'm not doing much praying at all right now. 

spitchips

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：27/10/2008 5:28 AMCopy HTML

 Hey spitchips its all good, take you time, and in your own time you will know when your ready to start looking at other places to fellowship, as urchin says and i concure its about a relationship with God/Jesus, nothing to do with where you chose to "fellowship" it may be traditional ie baptist, church of england etc or other charismatic churches, its all down to where you find your being fed looked after and loved for who you are not what you can do /bring to the table.

For me the measuring up took awhile to get out of the system after 37 years of revers it was a hard one for me to get over and to know that God loves me for who i am.

Its all still very very fresh for you, and our prayers and thoughts are with you as you rediscover things and find truths, you will go through all sorts of emotions from happiness /relief to anger anxiety etc, its all part of the process, find someone you can trust and be real with and that they can be real with you and take it each day as it comes.

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：27/10/2008 8:32 AMCopy HTML

 Hi Spitchips,
I just wanted to reiterate similar thought to Earth5.
For my self I just needed to stop and breath for a while and let the shock of actually making the decision to walk away settle. I refused to think about anything for 6 months but admittedly I was a mess and had to let the flesh wounds heal abit!!
There is probably enough emotional turmoil within your thoughts at the moment without trying to undo 30+ years of twisted scriptures in your first week out.

My thoughts are with you and will  pray for peace with-in you.

As I hear it, I'll repeat it, Its up to you if you believe it! Allegation big and small, soon revealed before us all. outa here- Outa Egypt!

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：27/10/2008 10:38 AMCopy HTML

Hiya again Outa

You got me in one! Gotta RELAX, RELAX, RELAX .. ha ha ...  I'll do it yet.

I'm going in all directions at once - not a good look.

Had a good giggle today at Brolga and getting old ... my nan is 100 in January ... so I intend to be around for quite a bit yet - plenty of time to reassess and sort it all out.

Thanks (to you all) for the kindness. The peace that passes understanding is the goal ultimately. 

good night

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：28/10/2008 9:44 AMCopy HTML

Hi, Theresa.

When it comes time for you to enter into Christian fellowship, my advice would be to avoid anything remotely 'Pentecostal' as you would the plague! 

Better to recover and learn from a more biblically-based source, one that won't simply reinforce many of the incorrect dogmas and behaviours that you imbibed during your time in "Revival" 

Blessings,

Ian

email: didaktikon@gmail.com

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：28/10/2008 10:10 AMCopy HTML

Hey Ian

Sounds like advice I could follow easily ... I certainly don't want to go out of the fat and into the fire ... not sure about choosing anything right now.

Getting my head around the lengthy essay you wrote on Acts and the different interpretations possible. It all seemed so clear as it was taught. Why else would so many be convinced? 

My plan is to not have a plan right now but wait and meditate. 

Sounds like I know what I'm doing - not really. But, again, I do appreciate you advising me this way. What sort of fellowship do you have?

blessings back at you

Theresa

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：28/10/2008 10:34 PMCopy HTML

Good morning, Theresa.

Sounds like advice I could follow easily ... I certainly don't want to go out of the fat and into the fire ... not sure about choosing anything right now.

Understood. However, the longer that you wait, the more difficult integration into conventional Christianity becomes. You see, we humans have a way of formulating excuses for not re-engaging with others, and then for convincing ourselves that our arguments for not doing so are actually sound!

Getting my head around the lengthy essay you wrote on Acts and the different interpretations possible. It all seemed so clear as it was taught. Why else would so many be convinced?

First the essay was lengthy because it was intended to be somewhat definitive, it needed to demonstrate beyond any shadow of doubt that what Revivalists believe simply can't be supported or sustained from what Scripture actually teaches. Further, the fact remains that the number of valid interpretations of any biblical passage is rather limited, extraordinarily so. What may appear to be a convincing case is often quickly shown not to be valid at all, when the matter is reviewed in detail. That is what I set out to demonstrate with respect to the Revivalist "tongues" message nonsense and the book of Acts.

But the reason that the Revivalist position seemed to be so clear to you is simple. To begin with, they presented you with a very simplistic and straightforward proposition: when one receives the Holy Spirit, one will automatically speak in "tongues". Next, they trawled through the New Testament and located a number of verses, which, when lifted and isolated from their immediate literary and theological contexts, appeared to support their proposition. Consequently, you were conditioned, and from the outset, to accept a completely illegitimate way of approaching Scripture: as a mine for proof-texts! When non-Revivalists read precisely the same verses, but then as they appear in their proper and extended contexts, they don't walk away thinking,"...hmmm. I need to speak in "tongues" if I have the Holy Spirit."

My plan is to not have a plan right now but wait and meditate.

Which is certainly fair and appropriate. But keep in mind the old saying: "...if you fail to plan, then plan to fail."

Sounds like I know what I'm doing - not really. But, again, I do appreciate you advising me this way. What sort of fellowship do you have?

Well, to begin with I trust that other posts I've submitted on other threads in this forum point out that "lone Ranger" Christianity simply isn't a biblically option: Christianity is anchored in corporate participation. Consequently, my family and I participate in the corporate life of an established Christian church. For the past three or four years we've been a part of a large church (about 700 people) that's affiliated with the Baptist Union of Victoria.  Prior to this; however, we ministered and were ministered to in a smaller, independent/inter-denominational church of about 110 people (for around five years). The change was due to the much greater range of services (youth group, social functions, etc) that were available in the Baptist church for our teen-aged daughters, services that our smaller church simply couldn't provide. Our preference is for the smaller, more intimate type of congregation, so when our daughters eventually move on, we will seek out another such group.

I should probably state about now that I'm not a Baptist, nor do I uncritically support Baptist theology (as my Baptist theological students would quickly attest to!). But Baptist Union Baptists are orthodox in their beliefs, and they do present as a perfectly suitable option. Put simply, one won't go off the rails by fellowshipping in such a denomination (as a rule).

It's my considered opinion that a Christian grows best in an orthodox communion, one that's not ignorant of Christian history, one that's adequately informed by tradition, and one that's led by an appropriately gifted and appropriately trained minister or ministers. In my experience, this more-or-less encompasses the Catholic (Eastern and Western), and the Reformation-era churches. Given that Revivalists have been grossly (and incorrectly) indoctrinated against the Catholic options, it's to the Reformation-era churches that we now turn. The most learned pastors of my acquaintance are generally either Anglican or Presbyterian-trained, both denominations also being the beneficiaries of uplifting and inspiring liturgical traditions. The same can also be said of the Lutherans, by the way. Any of these three denominations would be a very good choice, or would present as a very good point of departure from which to assess other groups.

You hinted previously that you live in Sydney. This being so, then you're simply spoiled for choice! The Anglican Diocese of Sydney is staunchly evangelical, it's ministers are required to be highly proficient in both biblical and theological studies, as well as in the various branches of pastoralia (preaching, counselling, etc). The same is equally true of Sydney Presbyetrians, although the Anglicans are certainly far more numerous.

You certainly have options 

God bless,

Ian

email: didaktikon@gmail.com

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Re：unsure but feeling free

Date Posted：29/10/2008 6:43 AMCopy HTML

Hi again Ian

Thanks for your detailed message. Have read it a few times and it's making sense to me. I'm finding it very humbling to see how easily we can be led the wrong way ... having been so judgemental of others for so long. Thankfully I was a bit 'slack' when it came to making enemies with 'the world' and haven't burned all my bridges. My extended family is pretty well intact and was not overly wounded by my wielding the 'sword of the spirit', although I did maim a few friendships in the beginning, and 'shunned' very successfully a few good friends who chose or who were asked to leave.

It will be interesting to have bible study in any form that is not based on pointing out 'proof' scriptures alone and in an unnatural way. I do look forward to looking about a finding a church here that will guide and teach me without putting too much pressure on me. Guess I need to know more and more that, because I believe, I'm OK. I want to WANT to fellowship, if that makes sense - not out of a sense of turning up and being counted.

I am spoilt for choice and that's lucky. I like the idea, like yourself, of a small fellowship where I can get to know people easily. But I'm pretty outgoing and I will make new friends easily if I have the right heart.

I know a lot of my RF mates are wondering what's going on in my mind and there will be a number of calls (already been a few) coming my way. 

Thanks to you and epi and outa and moth and earth here, I'm not feeling like an alien as much as I was even a week ago. I know my saviour liveth and that I am a child of God. I may now seriously doubt my methods over these years (there's an understatement) but I don't doubt the many blessings and answers to prayer along the way. 
I've left a few unresolved matters with RF that I intend to tidy up in this coming week. 
I hope I haven't over-used this forum. But I have been truly excited to get replies and to know I'm not alone here.
cheers and blessings
Theresa

spitchips
Rank：Rookier III Score：2050 Posts：98 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 4:59 AM	Date Posted：25/10/2008 5:19 AMCopy HTML My first post - not sure it warrants a new topic, though. Not sure what the correct protocol is there ... Maybe I should have called myself 'not sure'?? I walked away from RV last week after 31 years - yes, I can hardly believe that myself. As my topic suggests, feeling very unsure but somehow liberated. Perhaps it's just the extra free time I have in a week ha ha. Not funny, really, I know. I've been a full-on towing the line kinda gal for all this time. Any suggestions on regaining my identity? I don't feel too bad, considering, but waver from feeling liberated to feeling about to be caught out.
Jojo the Lion	Share to: #1
Rank：Rookier II Score：1870 Posts：83 From：Unknown Register：09/02/2004 9:29 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 5:30 AMCopy HTML Congrats for making what is bound to be the right decision. If you are like me and like most people who stepped out you will go through a cycle of emotions. Take it easy, DON'T PANIC! Go easy on yourself, give yourself time. Google is your friend. There is a ton of stuff on this site and many others for advice in what to do now. Which assembly were you in? I found personally that this site was immensely helpful to me. And here I sit so patiently waiting to find out what price / I have to pay to get out of going through all these things twice
spitchips	Share to: #2
Rank：Rookier III Score：2050 Posts：98 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 4:59 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 5:33 AMCopy HTML I should have written RF - sorry. Sydney. I was there alone, my family long gone, but have received no 'I told you so's', which is good. I'll be fine I'm sure - thanks for the NO PANIC suggestion. I've been reading this site now for about 5 days - found much to laugh at and cry at but mostly enjoying the banter of old friends ... bit like eavesdropping in a good way. Where were you before you left?
Didaktikon	Share to: #3
Rank：Noobmeister Score：421 Posts：13 From：Australia Register：29/08/2007 7:54 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 6:03 AMCopy HTML Hi, Theresa. Where to for you, now? Are you interested in making sense of what happened to you in the RF? Of making sense of what biblical Christianity is all about? If so, you might like to visit www.pleaseconsider.info (shameless self-promotion I know, but Drew and I put that site together for people in your situation) Blessings, Ian email: didaktikon@gmail.com
spitchips	Share to: #4
Rank：Rookier III Score：2050 Posts：98 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 4:59 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 6:47 AMCopy HTML Thanks, Ian. I've been pretty impressed with your vast knowledge of all things scriptural, you and others like Moth and others. I've found myself in this week looking to 'start again' in some ways. I'd really grown away from my own love of Jesus and just 'walked the walk' but felt so little of it. I'm keen to read your shameless self-promoted site ... I'm a bit pleased that I didn't just fade away from RF, but made the relevant goodbyes (very difficult and tricky) but now feel I can move on. Anyhow, blessings right back at you. Thanks for taking the time to reply to me. Theresa
Ex_Member	Share to: #5
Rank： Score：0 Posts：0 From：Unknown Register：21/09/2018 12:36 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 8:25 AMCopy HTML spitchips, No more sailing on "The Black Pearl", hey? Now for the good adventures to begin. Read Luke chapter15:........(Note V7) and see to whom it is referring to now. Jesus knows who His sheep are. regards brolga
spitchips	Share to: #6
Rank：Rookier III Score：2050 Posts：98 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 4:59 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 9:42 AMCopy HTML Oh, Brolga, you made me smile. I'm beginning to look forward to the new journey on the high seas, what? I'll do as you suggest and get back to you. For the record, I'm a bit miffed at myself for being stubborn so long and 'hanging in there' through thick and thin. 'Overcoming' it wasn't, just subborness. I finally feel like reading my bible to see what I should be doing. I'm a lucky girl and I'm determined not to be resentful or to mourn the years lost, so much as run with the new energy I feel. To think I may never have summoned the courage. I'm a bit proud of myself if I must be honest. Will read Luke and remember who I am. I've always loved 'my sheep will hear my voice'. I'm hoping my steps will now be ordered by the Lord and no-one else, ah? regards and blessings Theresa
MothandRust	Share to: #7
Rank：Forum Oracle Score：41550 Posts：1881 From：Australia Register：27/02/2004 11:21 PM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 9:43 AMCopy HTML Thanks so much for dropping in. Certainly and definitely worth a newtopic! To hear about you leaving that group after sooo many years...it's admirable and amazing. Enjoy the free time your weeks now allowyou to get to know yourself and the planet outside of the walls you'vebeen boxed in for so long. I hope you don't feel you need to 'rush'into another organisation or a group. You really need to de-frag yourmind and not try to fill the void, or even perhaps loneliness, thatcomes from coming out of a group that was so communal. There's no rush, despite their fearful warnings that 'The Lord is coming soon'. Let him come. I'm sure your family is far too busy sighing with relief and happiness to think about 'I told you sos'.Mine were. It's great that you were able to say proper goodbyes tofriends at RF. That's some great closure that will enable a smoothtransition out of the system. No bad blood I hope, and RF members seemto not shun so aggressively as they used to. You might feel likethere's a feeling of disappointment from them towards you, but that'snormal and is their problem, not yours. I've had a bad day, but hearing your story here, even briefly hasreally lifted my spirits. Thanks again and I hope to hear more from youas you go. If you do decide to stick around intermiitently here, trynot to get addicted to the forum :-P Very cool. Moth. Instagram and Twitter: @mothpete
spitchips	Share to: #8
Rank：Rookier III Score：2050 Posts：98 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 4:59 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 9:51 AMCopy HTML Hi Moth Oh, I see how easily I could become addicted to this forum. So instant and edgy ... I'll be careful. Thank you for your kindness and I hope your day tomorrow is much better. Yep, it's the disappointment and the fallout I caused behind me that made me the saddest. I'll not rush into anything - defraging is an understatement but I appreciate the analogy. I've read many posts between yourself, Ian and others - very amusing and disarmingly honest. I'm still a bit afraid that someone is gonna rap me over the knuckles (guess that will hang haunt me for a bit). blessings Theresa
MothandRust	Share to: #9
Rank：Forum Oracle Score：41550 Posts：1881 From：Australia Register：27/02/2004 11:21 PM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 10:08 AMCopy HTML Heya I think I stuck around for as long as I did in 'revival' land, dragging the chain like yourself, because I felt responsible for the souls of those who I felt looked up to me, and out of duty to the great learned men of the hierarchy (tongues in cheek). I felt irreplacable but it seems they were able to survive without me... and more's the pity - ha. I also held onto an unhealthy fear of authority, but these shmucks (sorry about the name calling) do not have any authority over you or your life. These Egyptians, they're just men, they're not gods. They're just big fish in very very little ponds, but it must feel very daunting to be out in the ocean away from them. My mind is still boggling over the thought of realligning yourself to reality after 31 years. Were you born into it? Instagram and Twitter: @mothpete
spitchips	Share to: #10
Rank：Rookier III Score：2050 Posts：98 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 4:59 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 11:05 AMCopy HTML Hi Moth I'm not feeling too terrible - I do get what you say about authority, though. A phone call would make the old heart start a thumpin, I'm sure. It's daunting alright, but it's kind of exciting now and I will not beat myself up too much about time 'wasted'. Could be I'm in shock after just a week and it will hit all at once? I did have a lot of people looking up to me, for whatever reasons - sounds familiar when you put it that way.
outaegypt	Share to: #11
Rank：Poster Venti I Score：6570 Posts：312 From：Unknown Register：22/06/2006 3:38 PM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 12:21 PMCopy HTML Reply to spitchips Hey Spitchips, Great to read your post and even though you are a little unsure, you have an assuredness about you that I'm sure will guide you through. Your new found enthusiasm is a great way to start your new journey. When we first left we were a bit in shock and I think also we felt almost a mourning for the life we left. Now I mourn for the life we wasted being governed and oppressed by such insignificant gits. Talk about miss placed loyalties!!! So do you feel like a naughty school girl? At meeting times, do you feel like your skipping class and your gonna get busted? Consider yourself expelled, their authority is irrelevant to you now. Obedient to Christ not man. Your working out your own salvation -no doubt with a little fear and trembling!! But it's your responsibility- not theirs. It's a bit funny, how when we are grown up responsible adults but yet we gave so much credence to what the oversight said. For me it was almost feeling like a child needing my guardians approval, proving my worth, almost a validation if that makes any sense. I still struggle to believe that I allowed them that power and held them in such esteem and sad that I cast my pearls before such swine. When push came to shove they showed their true colours. I wonder how much more effective for Christ we may have been had we been nurtured properly and allowed to give and grow. Last Sunday was an Honour day for the volunteers that operate the food/clothing co-op at the church we are presently attending. I was in awe of the expression of Gods love in their works. In retrospect we have led such a greedy, self seeking existence in the RC's we helped no one, well very few anyway, most times not even each other. We watched a video of people in need being ministered to, not just in receiving substance but also giving ear to their plights, understanding and being treated with respect, some even taking comfort by having someone pray for whatever their troubles. The Rc's are so far away from the love of God to be able to Love your brother as yourself. So Theresa, Welcome back into the world that God created for you to enjoy and not to be afraid of. The Rc world is an insular falsehood that has kept us not only separate to the world but separate from the fullness of being alive in Christ. Our lights have been hidden under the Bushels called RCF/RCI. Shine on sister! This site has often been a place of solace and comfort when others can't understand where I have come from. Initially it was quite a life line for my family, some where to belong when I felt quite lost. Now at times it's a bit like a diary but with the ability of response- sometimes in the form of support, other times correction and the occasional antagonist. Take what you need, give what you can and leave what you don't want- somebody else might want it!! As I hear it, I'll repeat it, Its up to you if you believe it! Allegation big and small, soon revealed before us all. outa here- Outa Egypt!
Sea Urchin	Share to: #12
Rank：Poster Venti III Score：9110 Posts：436 From：Australia Register：15/02/2007 7:34 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 1:07 PMCopy HTML Hi Theresa Firstly, welcome to the forum and welcome to the liberty of Christ. I loved hearing your story and would love to chat with you some more and get to know you. We're the same age and I was in RC/RF for 24 years before leaving almost 2 years ago. My husband, myself and our daughter & her husband all left together along with around 30 others from the Adelaide assembly. I did all the 'right' things and got to all the door knocks, coffee mornings, meetings etc etc but didn't really have a relationship with Jesus Christ - my relationship was with the organisation, amazing really! I look back now and see that it was all just 'works'. I had no understanding for that whole time of the grace of God. A pastor at the church I attend nowadays has a saying 'the God you know is the God you show'. The rf only know a God of judgment, control, fear etc so that is all they're able to 'show'. But praise God, I've come to know a God of mercy, love, grace, compassion and so very much more and THAT is what I am now able to show others. I'm so very very pleased to hear that you have left and that you have not been too wounded in doing so - many people hold on to bitterness against these groups and then that only ends up eating away at them. To be able to move on into the liberty that Jesus Christ has for us is a truly amazing journey and I wish you well in it. Will talk again soon, God bless you & your family Love, Urchin x x Your unfailing love, O Lord, is as vast as the heavens; your faithfulness reaches beyond the clouds. Your righteousness is like the mighty mountains, your justice like the ocean depths.
Ex_Member	Share to: #13
Rank： Score：0 Posts：0 From：Unknown Register：21/09/2018 12:36 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 5:35 PMCopy HTML Hi Theresa, Welcome to the wider Christian community - and to freedom. It's a big step to take after so many years. Your family must be overjoyed. You know we just don't realise while in RF etc what an atmosphere of dependence has been created within those halls. Breaking free, even though no-one bars the way, is not that easy and does take courage. I left 17 months ago and have no desire to return, although for the first few months I felt sad. During these times I'd think of the frequent usage of certain words and sayings, chiches which I found tiresome, like "I just can't wait for the Lord's return" and others. Well, I'm enjoying the wait and relying fully on the Lord Jesus while I'm waiting. I am now the person God made me rather than the person I was expected to be according to RF. Look forward to "hearing" from you again. Joy and peace of the Lord be with you. Epi
Heregoes	Share to: #14
Rank：Newbie Score：570 Posts：21 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 11:22 PM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：25/10/2008 11:24 PMCopy HTML Hi Theresa, I think I may know you. Were you a bridesmaid at a wedding in 1982?
spitchips	Share to: #15
Rank：Rookier III Score：2050 Posts：98 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 4:59 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：26/10/2008 9:07 AMCopy HTML To Outer, Urchin and Epi Thanks for your very insightful words ... mulling them over. Lots of consider there but i do recognise sincerity when I hear it! To Heregoes Not sure - so long ago. Maybe. Spitchips
Ex_Member	Share to: #16
Rank： Score：0 Posts：0 From：Unknown Register：21/09/2018 12:36 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：26/10/2008 9:53 PMCopy HTML Hey Spitchips, welcome to freedom and this site, like most on here we have found it usefull and challengeing. The best advice i had when I/we left was to sit back relax if you dont always understand something ask (so nice to ask without being told of) Anyway, your life has started another phase now one for good. I know the 1st christmas we had after years and years of xmas camps was a bit weird and of course what to do on new years eve was a question. Me and mrs earth took the time to still pray it in but in thanks to a new life and start in our journey. Ian is correct in viewing please consider, it is most helpful in debunking revivalist myths and legends, and he is more that happy to answer questions for you. Urchin, Epi i think will be most helpful to you in working through things, and there are many on here leading great lives that have much to consider and to advise you on. I pray that your time now is fruitfull, and we all understand what you will be going through to some extent. God Bless earth5
spitchips	Share to: #17
Rank：Rookier III Score：2050 Posts：98 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 4:59 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：27/10/2008 1:47 AMCopy HTML Hi earth5 Ta for your wise words. I'll be taking some time to read 'please consider' - already been browsing. Not feeling very motivated/inspired to wrangle and I certainly don't feel any loyalties to anyone but my family right now. I am happy to sit back for a while and think. I'm glad Jesus knows what's going on, because I don't have much of a clue. My inclination is to be able to find somewhere to fellowship when I want to without the feeling of measuring up/not measuring up. My 'slide' to the outside world has been a bit gradual ... I found myself more and more enjoying the company of 'real' people .... guess that's where this all started. After this week/10 days I'm still wondering about my own reaction when someone 'follows' me up, which is inevitable. I don't want to be cruel to anyone - I've got genuine friends in RF and they all want to have coffee and chat when I'm ready. Re-reading the above, I realise that I'm more caught up right now with what people are thinking rather than my own future. I'll get over it ... scuse the whinge. I feel like a need a week to sit at my computer and read indepth, with no distractions, all that debunks what I've been taught for so long. I appreciate you praying for me because I'm not doing much praying at all right now. spitchips
Ex_Member	Share to: #18
Rank： Score：0 Posts：0 From：Unknown Register：21/09/2018 12:36 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：27/10/2008 5:28 AMCopy HTML Hey spitchips its all good, take you time, and in your own time you will know when your ready to start looking at other places to fellowship, as urchin says and i concure its about a relationship with God/Jesus, nothing to do with where you chose to "fellowship" it may be traditional ie baptist, church of england etc or other charismatic churches, its all down to where you find your being fed looked after and loved for who you are not what you can do /bring to the table. For me the measuring up took awhile to get out of the system after 37 years of revers it was a hard one for me to get over and to know that God loves me for who i am. Its all still very very fresh for you, and our prayers and thoughts are with you as you rediscover things and find truths, you will go through all sorts of emotions from happiness /relief to anger anxiety etc, its all part of the process, find someone you can trust and be real with and that they can be real with you and take it each day as it comes.
outaegypt	Share to: #19
Rank：Poster Venti I Score：6570 Posts：312 From：Unknown Register：22/06/2006 3:38 PM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：27/10/2008 8:32 AMCopy HTML Hi Spitchips, I just wanted to reiterate similar thought to Earth5. For my self I just needed to stop and breath for a while and let the shock of actually making the decision to walk away settle. I refused to think about anything for 6 months but admittedly I was a mess and had to let the flesh wounds heal abit!! There is probably enough emotional turmoil within your thoughts at the moment without trying to undo 30+ years of twisted scriptures in your first week out. My thoughts are with you and will pray for peace with-in you. As I hear it, I'll repeat it, Its up to you if you believe it! Allegation big and small, soon revealed before us all. outa here- Outa Egypt!
spitchips	Share to: #20
Rank：Rookier III Score：2050 Posts：98 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 4:59 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：27/10/2008 10:38 AMCopy HTML Hiya again Outa You got me in one! Gotta RELAX, RELAX, RELAX .. ha ha ... I'll do it yet. I'm going in all directions at once - not a good look. Had a good giggle today at Brolga and getting old ... my nan is 100 in January ... so I intend to be around for quite a bit yet - plenty of time to reassess and sort it all out. Thanks (to you all) for the kindness. The peace that passes understanding is the goal ultimately. good night
Didaktikon	Share to: #21
Rank：Noobmeister Score：421 Posts：13 From：Australia Register：29/08/2007 7:54 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：28/10/2008 9:44 AMCopy HTML Hi, Theresa. When it comes time for you to enter into Christian fellowship, my advice would be to avoid anything remotely 'Pentecostal' as you would the plague! Better to recover and learn from a more biblically-based source, one that won't simply reinforce many of the incorrect dogmas and behaviours that you imbibed during your time in "Revival" Blessings, Ian email: didaktikon@gmail.com
spitchips	Share to: #22
Rank：Rookier III Score：2050 Posts：98 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 4:59 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：28/10/2008 10:10 AMCopy HTML Hey Ian Sounds like advice I could follow easily ... I certainly don't want to go out of the fat and into the fire ... not sure about choosing anything right now. Getting my head around the lengthy essay you wrote on Acts and the different interpretations possible. It all seemed so clear as it was taught. Why else would so many be convinced? My plan is to not have a plan right now but wait and meditate. Sounds like I know what I'm doing - not really. But, again, I do appreciate you advising me this way. What sort of fellowship do you have? blessings back at you Theresa
Didaktikon	Share to: #23
Rank：Noobmeister Score：421 Posts：13 From：Australia Register：29/08/2007 7:54 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：28/10/2008 10:34 PMCopy HTML Good morning, Theresa. Sounds like advice I could follow easily ... I certainly don't want to go out of the fat and into the fire ... not sure about choosing anything right now. Understood. However, the longer that you wait, the more difficult integration into conventional Christianity becomes. You see, we humans have a way of formulating excuses for not re-engaging with others, and then for convincing ourselves that our arguments for not doing so are actually sound! Getting my head around the lengthy essay you wrote on Acts and the different interpretations possible. It all seemed so clear as it was taught. Why else would so many be convinced? First the essay was lengthy because it was intended to be somewhat definitive, it needed to demonstrate beyond any shadow of doubt that what Revivalists believe simply can't be supported or sustained from what Scripture actually teaches. Further, the fact remains that the number of valid interpretations of any biblical passage is rather limited, extraordinarily so. What may appear to be a convincing case is often quickly shown not to be valid at all, when the matter is reviewed in detail. That is what I set out to demonstrate with respect to the Revivalist "tongues" message nonsense and the book of Acts. But the reason that the Revivalist position seemed to be so clear to you is simple. To begin with, they presented you with a very simplistic and straightforward proposition: when one receives the Holy Spirit, one will automatically speak in "tongues". Next, they trawled through the New Testament and located a number of verses, which, when lifted and isolated from their immediate literary and theological contexts, appeared to support their proposition. Consequently, you were conditioned, and from the outset, to accept a completely illegitimate way of approaching Scripture: as a mine for proof-texts! When non-Revivalists read precisely the same verses, but then as they appear in their proper and extended contexts, they don't walk away thinking,"...hmmm. I need to speak in "tongues" if I have the Holy Spirit." My plan is to not have a plan right now but wait and meditate. Which is certainly fair and appropriate. But keep in mind the old saying: "...if you fail to plan, then plan to fail." Sounds like I know what I'm doing - not really. But, again, I do appreciate you advising me this way. What sort of fellowship do you have? Well, to begin with I trust that other posts I've submitted on other threads in this forum point out that "lone Ranger" Christianity simply isn't a biblically option: Christianity is anchored in corporate participation. Consequently, my family and I participate in the corporate life of an established Christian church. For the past three or four years we've been a part of a large church (about 700 people) that's affiliated with the Baptist Union of Victoria. Prior to this; however, we ministered and were ministered to in a smaller, independent/inter-denominational church of about 110 people (for around five years). The change was due to the much greater range of services (youth group, social functions, etc) that were available in the Baptist church for our teen-aged daughters, services that our smaller church simply couldn't provide. Our preference is for the smaller, more intimate type of congregation, so when our daughters eventually move on, we will seek out another such group. I should probably state about now that I'm not a Baptist, nor do I uncritically support Baptist theology (as my Baptist theological students would quickly attest to!). But Baptist Union Baptists are orthodox in their beliefs, and they do present as a perfectly suitable option. Put simply, one won't go off the rails by fellowshipping in such a denomination (as a rule). It's my considered opinion that a Christian grows best in an orthodox communion, one that's not ignorant of Christian history, one that's adequately informed by tradition, and one that's led by an appropriately gifted and appropriately trained minister or ministers. In my experience, this more-or-less encompasses the Catholic (Eastern and Western), and the Reformation-era churches. Given that Revivalists have been grossly (and incorrectly) indoctrinated against the Catholic options, it's to the Reformation-era churches that we now turn. The most learned pastors of my acquaintance are generally either Anglican or Presbyterian-trained, both denominations also being the beneficiaries of uplifting and inspiring liturgical traditions. The same can also be said of the Lutherans, by the way. Any of these three denominations would be a very good choice, or would present as a very good point of departure from which to assess other groups. You hinted previously that you live in Sydney. This being so, then you're simply spoiled for choice! The Anglican Diocese of Sydney is staunchly evangelical, it's ministers are required to be highly proficient in both biblical and theological studies, as well as in the various branches of pastoralia (preaching, counselling, etc). The same is equally true of Sydney Presbyetrians, although the Anglicans are certainly far more numerous. You certainly have options God bless, Ian email: didaktikon@gmail.com
spitchips	Share to: #24
Rank：Rookier III Score：2050 Posts：98 From：Australia Register：25/10/2008 4:59 AM	Re：unsure but feeling free Date Posted：29/10/2008 6:43 AMCopy HTML Hi again Ian Thanks for your detailed message. Have read it a few times and it's making sense to me. I'm finding it very humbling to see how easily we can be led the wrong way ... having been so judgemental of others for so long. Thankfully I was a bit 'slack' when it came to making enemies with 'the world' and haven't burned all my bridges. My extended family is pretty well intact and was not overly wounded by my wielding the 'sword of the spirit', although I did maim a few friendships in the beginning, and 'shunned' very successfully a few good friends who chose or who were asked to leave. It will be interesting to have bible study in any form that is not based on pointing out 'proof' scriptures alone and in an unnatural way. I do look forward to looking about a finding a church here that will guide and teach me without putting too much pressure on me. Guess I need to know more and more that, because I believe, I'm OK. I want to WANT to fellowship, if that makes sense - not out of a sense of turning up and being counted. I am spoilt for choice and that's lucky. I like the idea, like yourself, of a small fellowship where I can get to know people easily. But I'm pretty outgoing and I will make new friends easily if I have the right heart. I know a lot of my RF mates are wondering what's going on in my mind and there will be a number of calls (already been a few) coming my way. Thanks to you and epi and outa and moth and earth here, I'm not feeling like an alien as much as I was even a week ago. I know my saviour liveth and that I am a child of God. I may now seriously doubt my methods over these years (there's an understatement) but I don't doubt the many blessings and answers to prayer along the way. I've left a few unresolved matters with RF that I intend to tidy up in this coming week. I hope I haven't over-used this forum. But I have been truly excited to get replies and to know I'm not alone here. cheers and blessings Theresa