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Date Posted:09/11/2009 12:59 AMCopy HTML

Nice Youtube on Messianic Jewry. If you are not Ian, best use the English subtitles.

Strange that Jews on becoming Christians still insist on circumcising their sons ...


Didaktikon Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #1
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Re:Messianic Jewry

Date Posted:09/11/2009 2:07 AMCopy HTML

Hi, Eric.

Well, not so strange if you think about it. Jewish people place considerable emphasis on the three-fold Abrahamic Covenant (i.e. "land, "seed" and "blessing"), with circumcision understood as being the defining physical sign associated with inclusion in the covenant. Further, "Messianic Jews" perceive themselves as being Jewish first and foremost; "Messianic" secondarily. In many respect such are, theologically-considered, the inheritors of the "Judaizers" more so than of the apostles.

For this and several other reasons, I'd suggest that identifying oneself as a "Messianic Jew" doesn't necessarily mean that one is a Christian, properly speaking

Blessings,

Ian

email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Re:Messianic Jewry

Date Posted:09/11/2009 3:04 AMCopy HTML

Reply to Didaktikon

Hi, Eric.

Well, not so strange if you think about it. Jewish people place considerable emphasis on the three-fold Abrahamic Covenant (i.e. "land, "seed" and "blessing"), with circumcision understood as being the defining physical sign associated with inclusion in the covenant. Further, "Messianic Jews" perceive themselves as being Jewish first and foremost; "Messianic" secondarily. In many respect such are, theologically-considered, the inheritors of the "Judaizers" more so than of the apostles.

For this and several other reasons, I'd suggest that identifying oneself as a "Messianic Jew" doesn't necessarily mean that one is a Christian, properly speaking

Blessings,

Ian


I wonder if a "yiddish" translation of the Greek New Testament is easily available to Messianic Jews ??? I would suppose or presume there is.


But
being an intact male or not falls well outside the scope and thrust of Pauline theology as James soon found out.. Still your magnum opus on tongues in the temple has highlighted to me the centrality of Charis (c.f. Romans 4:13). And your correlation between the Divine Self Disclosure on Mt Sinai and the Divine Theophanic encounter on the Day Of Pentecost is quite clear.

Still if the message is reaching Jewish folk then the avenue will also be there to search a little deeper. In seven weeks time I shall investigate.. BTW I fly down to Sydney on the 1st Jan - stay overnight in a hotel and leave next morning on Cathay Pacific to HK and then via Royal Jordanian, I fly to Amman and then on to Tel Aviv International and then by bus to to JUC .. I will be there for the whole of January which is mid winter over there. 


charis soi

Eric

ps I am determined to get me a kippa with bobbie pins while I'm there !!! enough to cover my bald spot :-))
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Re:Messianic Jewry

Date Posted:09/11/2009 3:37 AMCopy HTML

Hi, Eric.

There is a modern Hebrew (i.e. Ivrit) edition of the New Testament, known as the "Brit Chadasha". I own one published by the Bible Society of Israel, which includes the standard BHS Old Testament. Speaking personally, I've found the "Brit Chadasha" makes for interesting reading, especially with respect to certain of the Pauline epistles!

Have fun in "Eretz Israel".

Blessings,

Ian

P.S. If you're interested, I wrote a review for the IBS Hebrew Bible for Amamzon. The following link will take you there:
(http://www.amazon.com/Hebrew-Bible-Society-Israel/product-reviews/9654310007/ref=cm_cr_dp_synop?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=0&sortBy=bySubmissionDateDescending#RNXEYTXCULLCQ)
email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Re:Messianic Jewry

Date Posted:19/11/2009 6:44 AMCopy HTML

Reply to Fremde

Metanoian,

I was born and raised in Caulfield, Victoria, which, post war was a strong Roman Catholic suburb, But by the time I finished High School (dropped out really) about a third of Caulfield High School was Jewish. Caulfield these days is very Jewish. In my last year my best friend was Michael and he was Jewish. We drifted after High School, but kept running into each other every few years and each time we relived our friendship. I got conscripted, married and joined the PRC (a Revival offshoot) and Michael was but an occasional memory. About 25 years ago we met again at a High School reunion and had a great time reminiscing about our misspent youth. Again we did no follow up. There was another School reunion five years later, but Michael was not there. I tracked him down to his business and when I walked in the door his face lit up. This time we kept the friendship alive. He had married another school friend's sister and his son was struggling with his first year of VCE, so my son who had become a schoolteacher became his tutor. The circle has grown with my "gentile" friends being introduced into their Jewish Community and Michael's friends and family being introduced into our community of friends, Christian and otherwise.

At a Reserve Army Gathering, I ran into yet another Jew I went to school with. He was alone and looking a bit isolated, so I approached him and reminded him of our school days. He already knew Michael, so the group enlarged.

Michael and I have had many discussions about Jesus Christ and I am forthright about telling him and other Jews about Christ as the Messiah. There is a very good DVD I bought from Koorong called "The Messiah: Prophecy Fulfilled" which I gave to Michael and a few days later he said to me "I had no idea that there were so many prophecies about the Messiah in the Torah". On Friday nights, for exercise and "fellowship" we would walk from North Caulfield where he lived  down through east St Kilda and Balaclava and back again, passing many Jews on their way to the many Synagogues, and we often ran into other Jews he knew, whom I would greet with "Shalom Shabbat" which means "Peaceful Sabbath". In discussing Jesus as the Jewish Messiah, in the New Testament, all of Hebrews and Romans Chapter 11 are excellent, because they are pointedly Jewish oriented.

I will email Michael the link to your Youtube clip. It will be interesting to see and hear his reaction.

Muzel tov,

John

Hi John, My apologies for not responding but through all the clatter of the daily postings with all those "goslings" vs Didaktikos, I somehow missed you altogether.

There is something I intend doing which will most likely unnerve Ian a little, and that is visit a synagogue service and actually watch every thing that goes on and take note. I might learn something. I have never been to a synagogue all my life but John when you read through the life of Paul through Acts and the Epistles and you see that the first works of the birthing of the church began in the synagogues. ( i.e Jesus taught in the synagogues, Paul started preaching in the synagogues etc.etc).  History teaches us that when the Romans sacked Jerusalem in AD70, the church broke away from Judaism altogether. (And I think Paul had already been martyred by the time of the Roman sacking but anyway.) .  But I really need to capture something of the context of the synagogues by actual observance and see if I can apply Paul in the context of his early missionary work. I'll harass one of the lecturers when we get over to Eretz Israel perhaps.

(By the way Ian is different. He makes the point of going along to any revivalist gathering that might be happening with the the hope he might get "witnessed to."
)

blessings John

Eric

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Re:Messianic Jewry

Date Posted:19/11/2009 8:59 PMCopy HTML

Good morning, John.

Well, the last time that I checked, Brisbane was in the Australian state of Queensland, not the American state of Alabama

Blessings,

Ian

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Re:Messianic Jewry

Date Posted:20/11/2009 6:00 AMCopy HTML

Reply to Fremde

Thanks for your reply Eric,

Your profile shows you as being in Alabama. The only thing I know about Alabama is that it's easy to take the ivory from Alabama Elephants because their "Tuskareloosa". In my youth I used to work for International Harvester in Melbourne and one of my bosses was from Alabama, hence I learned that corny Groucho Marx line.

I don't think you'd come all the way over here just to go to Synagogue with either of my closest Jewish friends Michael or Itzy, who I know would be pleased to bring you as their guest, but if USA Synagogues are anything like the ones here, you'd be welcomed I am sure.

A bit like Christian churches there is every flavour from Orthodox where men and women are separated, a lot of the ceremony/service is in Hebrew (there is usually a service guide in English), but the sermon is usually in English, and if the Rabbi knows a Gentile is present he will probably go the trouble of explaining what is going on and why and/or allocate someone to assist and befriend you, to the very Liberal Synagogues that tend to have a large part of the service in English, and Oy Evay! there may even be a Female Rabbi!

I have two copies (originals not pirated) of the DVD "Messiah Prophesy Fulfilled"

"A dramatic Gospel presentation of the birth of Christianity, showing how one rabbi becomes a follower of Yeshua of Nazareth. being filled with the Holy Spirit, Rabbi Yehudah zealously embarks on a journey to share the Good News with his people. He arrives to his hometown, precisely one year after the crucifixion, burial and resurrection of the Messiah. Now his greatest challenge is to convince his loved ones that the long awaited Messiah Son of David has finally come."

If you would like one (to keep) send me a private message with you address details and I will Airmail it to you.

Roses are red, violets are blueish, if Jesus hadn't come, we might all be Jewish!

Lech l'shalom (may you journey to peace)

John


Ta John,

I have sent a pm to you. (do let me know costs).

Well I do have one thing that is in common and is mandatory for all jewish men.

but anyway I won't be out of place when I get to Eretz Israel.. I suppose I would have to wear a kippa when I enter a synagogue..  I am interested though

anyway thanks John I have to be off now

blessings

Eric
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Re:Messianic Jewry

Date Posted:20/11/2009 6:14 AMCopy HTML

Eric,

Ian said you were located in/near Brisabane. A quick google search found the following synagogues in your vicinity. When I was a kid I was told that I would be welcome visiting sevices ar the local progressive synagogue  if I simply wore any hat.

http://www.mavensearch.com/synagogues/C3354Y41489RX
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