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Date Posted：09/12/2007 9:11 AMCopy HTML
Frequently Asked Questions --> Answers
|WHO ARE THE REVIVAL CENTRES?|
The Revival Centres are a religious group, that are often classed as the largest indigenous Australian cult. Their main teaching is that people "must be baptised and speak in tongues [ecstatic utterances] to be saved [get to heaven]". Other teachings include British-Israelism (that the white Aryan races are specially favoured by God), that the Pyramid of Cheops was designed by God, and several other less main-stream teachings. They also practice 'tithing', in which members must pay a tenth of their income to the group. In practice, the teaching on tongues and obedience to the leadership swallow up everything else. Teachings often stressed by other churches are deemphasised - for instance, while they say that Jesus is the Son of God, there is probably a lot more discussion about tongues than Jesus (his death, resurrection, etc.).
The Oversight's (leaders) control over the followers is enormous. Many leaders exert unashamed control: ordering marriages between members, sometimes telling parents where children can go to school, and forbidding members to attend meetings of Christian groups. Many ex-members tell of their constant fear of the leaders while they were in the cult. As an example, some of the RCI's rule follow:
5. Members should not enter into any conversation criticising doctrines, practices or beliefs held by the assembly. Again Pastors and Elders are ready to discuss any such problems that may arise.
10. Any cases of disloyalty towards the Assembly or spreading of any discord whatsoever will be viewed as "divisionary" and dealt with severely.
30. Members who indulge in smoking, drinking, drug taking or attendance at discos, night clubs or "worldly" parties, "R" rated movies or videos will be stood out of the assembly. Members must not attend outside entertainment during meeting times.
We use the generic term 'Revival Centres' on this Web site to refer to about 4 major groups: the Revival Centres International ('RCI'); Revival Fellowship ('IRF'); Geelong Revival Centres; and the Christian Assemblies (Europe and Australia).
|WHO ARE YOU?|
This Web site was made by several ex-Revival Centre members. It contains information that was given to us by many ex-members, including many ex-leaders.
|WHAT IS THE BACKGROUND OF THE RCs?|
The ancestor of the Revival Centres was the Christian Revival Crusade, which began in 1945 and was itself a conjuntion of Assembly of God (Leo Harris) and British Israel World Federation (Tom Foster) elements. RCI was a split from the Christian Revival Crusade in 1958. All the other groups are splits from RCI.
|WHO ARE ALL OF THE REVIVAL CENTRE GROUPS?|
(1) Revival Centres International
Founded by Lloyd Richard Longfield in 1958. Longfield had been a pastor with the Christian Revival Crusade since 1951. After disagreements with Tom Foster and Leo Harris, he took the Geelong, Port Lincoln (SA), and Canberra Revival Crusades with him. In the 1960's, the teaching that people must speak in tongues emerged. Since that time, the Revival Centres have had many splits and divisions (discussed later). Longfield ruled his assemblies in a very autocratic manner, but has now retired. His son, Simon, has since taken over as the leader of the RCI.
With around 40 congregations in Australia, New Zealand and a few overseas (inc. Italy, Africa, Canada), they have around 2000 members in Australia with most in Melbourne according to a census in the late 1990s.
(2) International Revival Fellowship
After the 1994 Christmas Camp, it was announced by Lloyd Longfield that those involved in sexual misconduct from 1995 would never be allowed back into fellowship. Adelaide and Melbourne had previously had disagreements about a related personal matter which Longfield had discovered when someone moved from Adelaide, and Kuhlmann refused to obey his directive to stand down a minister. Kuhlmann, who held most Adelaide property jointly in his own name, was able to turn most assemblies against Lloyd. In matters of doctrine and practice, the Fellowships are very similar to the Revival Centres, though lacking in part Longfield's charismatic leadership. In New South Wales and some other assemblies, there was a growing movement among members to 'loosen up a bit'. In the late 1990s, Adelaide lost several pastors to this movement.
With around 50 congregations in Australia and New Zealand, most of RCI's international work, and most of PNG now adheres to the IRF. It may have about 3000 members in Australia.
(3) Geelong Revival Centres
Assemblies in this group do not have any fixed names, and so are sometimes hard to identify. They are the result of a 1972 split between Noel Hollins (a joint founder of the RCs) and Longfield. Since that time, they seem to have become more insular than RCI itself. Unlike RCI, they still practice 'all speaking in tongues at once' (their split becoming before the RCI reform on that issue). Meetings are extremely controlled, and those who have left often give terrible stories.
About a dozen or so assemblies around Australia, and in Singapore, India, etc.
(4) Christian Assemblies International
Result of the 1991 split by Scott Williams who controlled much of the European work of the Revival Centres. Originally in Germany, now Scotland. Originally an Army instructor (and associated with the now extinct Pentecostal Revival Centres splinter). The Auckland group has a degree of independance from Europe, but apparently retains its ties.
(5) Other Groups
There are several other splinter groups, especially in Adelaide, most of which are very small, some of which are more orthodox theologically.
|WHY ARE YOU CAMPAINING AGAINST THE REVIVAL CENTRES?|
Many current members have asked why we campaign against the "Lord's church". We can assure you, we would never campaign against the Lord. We would only campaign against an unhealthy organisation that claims to represent the Lord and damages people. The RCI, RF and CAI are such organisations.
We do not wish ill toward any Revival Centre groups, neither do we have a personal vendetta against any leaders or members. We do however wish to share the truth we have discovered. This web site attempts to show the flaws within the Revival Centre doctrine. It also attempts to help those damaged by this movement to find wholeness through a living relationship with the Lord Jesus Christ or at least get on with their lives and leave the effects of the groups behind. Much of the information on this site may be distressing to some but we hope that no former or current Revivalists are left broken by these groups.
|WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO ACHIEVE BY THIS SITE?|
This site is primarily made to minister to people who have ALREADY LEFT the Revival Centres. For whatever reason, the Revival Centres leave many people confused, anxious and even depressed. We care for these people and want to lend them a hand.
A secondary reason is for people who are investigating the Revival Centres. By reading information on this site, we have been able to dissuade several people from joining the Revival Centres (introducing them to more orthodox groups).
A final reason is to deliver information to those formerly in the Revival Centres or those inside who are asking the tough questions. Cults thrive on blocking information and views contrary to the leadership. We see the Internet as a wonderful tool in ministry to people who are otherwise trapped by cult information control. Hopefully, we can be of help to people as they leave - or even better, to bring positive change in the Revival Centres. Of note is some comments we have been getting from the Revival Fellowship groups. After setting up these Web pages, there seems to have been a noticeable 'softening' of their attitudes, particulary towards several false teachings, such as British Israelism.
If you are happy and content in the Revival Centres then this site is not for you...yet! Come back when you are ready to hear an opposing point of view. We will not force our information on you.
|STOP BEING SO CRITICAL, WE DON'T WANT YOU CRITICISING OUR CHURCH!|
It is understandable that people don't want their religious organisations criticised. However, is it true that the Revival Centres don't criticise other religious organisations? Is it true that they often make jokes about the pope in meetings? Aren't they strongly critical of anything that happens in other Pentecostal churches? In fact, wouldn't it be true to say that they are critical of every other religious organisation in the world?
To put it crudely, we are only giving the Revival Centre leaders 'a taste of their own medicine'. We should point out that we are not critical of people in the group, we are critical of the false teachers who lead the groups. But healthy criticism, done in a good spirit, is a blessing to the body of Christ, and should be seen as such.
|AREN'T YOU JUST BITTER?|
The accusation of 'bitterness' is often used by the Revival Centres to dismiss any claims against the groups whether those claims are legitimate or not. We ask you to put aside emotion, yours and ours, and examine the information presented on this site. But let us add that contrary to popular Revival Centre opinion, those directly responsible for this site are not bitter towards the groups. Perhaps, individually, there was certainly a time when some of us were, but that time has long since passed.
Troy Waller once said, "I have forgiven the RCI. I must admit that I still find Lloyd Longfield a likable man. He is quite charismatic and funny. But someone must hold this group (and its splits) to account. They cannot be allowed to go unchallenged as they promote a false gospel with abusive and controlling methods of manipulating people."
|I'VE HEARD ABOUT YOU, YOU PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO GET REVENGE!|
No, we are not. We have a heart for Revival Centre people, and we want to do all we can to help them escape from abuse and control. Your leaders may have told you all sorts of things about this site, but you will find that we are not 'maligned' and we are not seeking 'revenge'. Paul Littlewood writes:
Those that leave the group (for any reason) are described in the worst way possible, they are proud and egotistical, hating authority, liars, deceivers, fornicators, yet none of these are true it's just the groups way of discrediting former members so the group avoid them, they will take extreme measures in most cases to avoid former members, some may even move residence.
There are many lies being spread about our site. They are being spread because your leaders do not want you reading this information, and realising that we are here to help.
|WE HAVE BEEN TOLD NOT TO READ ANY OF YOUR INFORMATION|
Well, that is YOUR choice. We don't force this site on anyone but make the information available to anyone who wants it. And what have the Revival Centres got to be afraid of? If they are preaching truth, then they have nothing to fear from someone giving an alternate viewpoint. Contrary to the Revival Centre position, the ancient apostles like Paul welcomed people judging them and their doctrines (1.Co.10:15).
|I THINK YOU SHOULD JUST GET ON WITH YOUR WALK AND FORGET THE REVIVAL CENTRES|
It is right to examine every message, messenger, and method according to the Word of God. The church at Ephesus was commended because they had "tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars " (Rev. 2:2). The church at Pergamos was rebuked because they tolerated those that held "the doctrine of Balaam, " and "the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes, which thing I hate" (Rev. 2:14,15). It is never right to tolerate false teachers, but they are to be tried by the Word of God, and exposed. Of course those who want to disobey the Word of God will seek by every means to avoid this teaching.
We are to mark and avoid false teachers: "Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them " (Rom. 16:17). And, we are to rebuke false teachers: "Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith " (Titus 1: 13). Are we to sit silently by, while Revival Centre false teachers take advantage of the weak, without rebuking and admonishing people to avoid their teaching? No, the faithful servant of the Lord is to be "Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers " (Titus 1:9).
Though, there is a balance. It is easy to get bitter and abusive when dealing with false teachers. We are warned to help those who are on the wrong path, and to get them back on track 'in a kind and gentle way'. We hope we have put the case against the Revival Centre false teachings in this Web site in a humble frame of mind - without being abusive and without being overly self-righteous.
|THIS WEB SITE IS FULL OF LIES AND HALF TRUTHS!|
Not to our knowledge. If you find something that is incorrect, please contact us and we will try to fix it as soon as possible. To our knowledge, all information on this site is accurate. If you believe that an allegation we make is wrong, please send us documentation to show why it is wrong, and we will be very happy to change it and print a retraction. We have no interest in advertising wrong information - the Revival Centres should stand or fall on the evidence presented in truth.
As a 'right of appeal', you could write your complaint in the Guestbook or Forum.
|THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR PUTTING UP THIS SITE!|
Thank you for liking it. If you really like this site, please put a comment and a bit of a testimony in the Guestbook. So then people get an idea how many people actually do write in and say that the sites are great. Some other things you can do are send us a testimony, send us your Revival Centre tapes (especially if they have some historical worth), send us articles you have written or news you have come across.
|YOU DON'T BELIEVE IN SPEAKING IN TONGUES!|
Some people involved in the running of this site still practice speaking in tongues and some people do not. But that is not important to us now. We are all in complete unity in that we believe the Bible teaches that people are saved by putting their faith in Jesus. This is what almost all churches believe and what has been taught by the church since the first century.
|YOU PEOPLE ALL BELIEVE DIFFERENT THINGS!|
YES WE DO! And thank God for that. We are now free to investigate doctrines and beliefs and make up our own minds. We are not forced give assent to the beliefs of one or two high ranking men in an organisation. Freedon is what we wish to share with you. But take note, this web site is not about everything that we believe as individuals but is about what we consider erroneous concerning the Revival Centres.
And when you look into it, you will probably find that the Revival Centres 'all believe different things' too. Despite the constant claims of 'unity', you will find that individual Revival Centre people have widely differing views on Christology, the nature of the Church, eschatology. For instance, even as to the divinity of Jesus, many Revival Centre people would confess that Jesus is God, while Lloyd Longfield himself does not believe that Jesus is God.
We all agree that salvation is through faith in Jesus alone. Like all Christians throughout history, we believe that someone is saved when they put their faith in Christ as Lord (John 3:16). The Revival Centres have an extreme emphasis on tongues. It is true that some of us have differing views on tongues to each other, but the Revival Centres do not understand that most Christians regard tongues as a fairly minor issue - at least, when compared to salvation by faith and the divinity of Christ. Tongues are only mentioned in 3 or 4 places in the whole body of scripture, and only a few times by Christian writers of the first century. Having different views in regard to minor issues is completely acceptable - Romans 14:1-10.
|WE BELIEVE IN JESUS, SO WE ARE SAVED AS WELL...|
The Revival Centres do not believe in salvation by faith in Jesus alone, though. They say that tongues and baptism are required, and Jesus may not even be mentioned in connection with salvation.
The gospel is defined in 1.Cor.15:1-4 as a belief in Jesus' death, burial, and ressurection. Paul also writes in Gal.1:8,9 never to depart from that gospel he had delievered to the saints. To do so would be anathema. Yet, this is what the Revival Centres do when they proclaim their new 'gospel of tongues'.
|DO YOU GET MONEY FOR ATTACKING THE REVIVAL CENTRES?|
Nobody has EVER made any money from the Counter-RC work done via this web site or any other activity. In fact, we have spent more of our own money on this work than may have been useful. In the mid 1990s we did ask people to help cover the costs of copying and mailing when we sent them information, but we never made a profit. Main costs came from printing and stamps. Since 1997, everything we offer is free via the website. The site is hosted and paid for by former members of the CAI.
|HOW DO YOU HANDLE CONFIDENTIALITY?|
If you are in contact with us, rest assured that it is completely confidential. No one else will know that you have contacted us.
We rarely have contact with any leaders in any of the Revival Centre groups.In fact, they usually refuse to speak to us anyway, as they preach that they should treat us as 'diseased sheep'. So, there is no way that anyone can know you have contacted us.
If you decide to participate in the Forum discussion group, you can remain completely anonymous.
|WHY DON'T YOU RESPOND TO MY E-MAIL?|
Firstly, if you are a Revival Centre person, and have written us an insulting or threatning note, you will probably not receive a response. We've got better things to do than respond to insults.
If your note was genuine, we should get to you in time. We receive a mountain of mail, mostly from ex-members, and it often takes us some time to reply as we do have lives to live as well. To get a quicker response, you may like to post on the Forum as there are many people there who are aware of the issues as well.
|WHAT CAUSED THE RCI/RF SPLIT?|
The is a lot of misinformation regarding the (Adelaide / Melbourne) split, and a lot of dirty laundry. Firstly, the official reason was probably not the main reason for the split. Longfield's teaching was in response to other events, including an event in London, which basically ended in a power struggle between Adelaide and Melbourne. You will find his talk on the Split was quite honest. Though, of course, theologically his doctrine regarding fornication is is completely unscriptural.
(N.B. our comments regarding the split are intentionally vague. Legal action has been threatened against one person who did write a bit of truth about it - did he hit a raw nerve?)
|I'M WITH THE REVIVAL FELLOWSHIP, NOT THE REVIVAL CENTRES!|
You're still in what many regard as a cult. This site is for members of all the Revival Centres splits.
The Revival Fellowship in most areas is no better than the Revival Centres. One exception is regarding some New South Wales Revival Fellowships, which may have become more orthodox.
|WHAT'S WITH THE NSW REVIVAL FELLOWSHIPS?|
We followed the story of the NSW Fellowships for a while. During the 1997 RF Convention, people started hearing of a 'move of God' in some of the eastern RFs. This has progressed to such a point that some of the NSW assemblies hold quite different meetings than Adelaide. Some members are now fellowshipping with those in other churches. Garry Hall (Sydney) held a closed meeting to try to bring things back to the way that they were. However, information we later received said that some members in NSW considered a split with Adelaide. (Note- This info is now very old)
|COULD YOU PLEASE EXPLAIN WHAT THE 'CARN BRAE SCANDAL' WAS?|
One of the earliest Revival Centre purchases was in March, 1966, when the congregation paid almost $100,000 for a property in Harcourt Street, Auburn in Melbourne. The land included a huge seventeen-roomed mansion which had formerly been the residence of the Lord Mayor of Melbourne.
Nearby residents feared that the building of a hall on the property would spoil the previously quiet character of the area, and their protests made newspaper headlines both in Victoria and interstate (The Herald 3/3/66, The Sun 5/3/66, see also Truth articles 'Sect that makes a Fortune' 5/9/70). Ultimately, permission to build the hall was refused. So then, Lloyd moved into the property himself and made it his home! It remained his home for many years, despite controversy over the moral implications. Outspoken critics, who were astonished at seeing their 'tithes' used for Longfield's own pleasures, were given the right foot of fellowship right out the door.
When Carn Brae was sold, Lloyd moved into Tara Hall, which may even be bigger than what Carn Brae was.
|HAVE THE REVIVAL CENTRES REALLY SET A DATE FOR THE END OF THE WORLD?|
Yes. While it is has not been emphasised in recent years, the Revival Centres have always held that the end of the world will happen before 17 September 2001. They have 'backed this up' from three fronts:
(1) The 6000 years theory. Because "a day is like a thousand years", the seventh thousand year would be the year of the Sabbath and Christ's return (who is 'Lord of the Sabbath'). Christ would then begin the 'thousand year reign'. All this was based on the year 3996 B.C. being the year of the creation of Adam (which is, in fact, highly questionable). You will see sold in Revival Centres a chart by Fox called 'God's Great Week', which points out 2001/2 as the day of the parousia.
(2) The 'seven times' teaching. Based on some obscure texts which are taken to mean 2520 years, which ends up being that the '1917 generation' will see the coming. If you have heard things about 'as birds flying' in the Revival Centres, this is what they were on about.
(3) Measurements from the Pyramid of Cheops, with the invented 'Pyramid Inch', 2001 is meant to be indicated by the Scriptures.
Similarly, Longfield has written, "It's 24 minutes before the start of a new day - the millennium reign - God's national Sabbath. Are you ready? At one minute past midnight (17th Sept 2001) His Majesty the Lord Jesus Christ will rule out of Zion. Are you ready?" (What time is it Now? pamphlet). Longfield apparently came to this date through David Davidson's The Path to Peace in Our Time: Outlined from the Great Pyramid's Prophecy (1942), in which the 17 September 2001 was argued. Though, you should note that Davidson has already failed with many of his other predicted dates. How would Jesus have reacted to claims that the Revival Centres knew when Jesus would return? Surely he would have remarked, "It is not for you to know the times or periods that the Father has set by his own authority" (Acts 1:7).
|I WANT TO LEAVE THE REVIVAL CENTRES, CAN YOU HELP?|
It is always great to get these messages. Please contact us when you are leaving, as it is good to be in contact with people when you are going through everything. When you decide to leave, or are considering it, please make note of a few tips.
1/ While you may not realise it now, leaving is a very big move. It is also very difficult, and many people cannot handle it alone. You should realise that your whole life will be turned upside down for a few months or years, and you will likely feel dreadful for a while. Many people feel anger at the Revival Centres for wasting so much of their life. Many also feel angry at themselves for going meekly along with the rubbish for so long. Some people feel angry at the Lord for letting them be decieved. These feelings are normal and they will go away in their own time. Don't rush your emotions. Don't let others tell you how you should feel within a certain time frame. We are all different and handle leaving differently. You will likely feel very uneasy about going to other churches, and you will feel angry at any other authority figures. Don't feel guilty about this.
You might like to take some time away from any fellowship - some feel that they need to be by themselves for a while. THIS IS FINE. When you are ready, go and explore other churches. Even though you may dread going to meetings, and you may be very critical of their doctrinal differences, compared to what you are used to, persist. You don't have to join another church until you feel ready, but exploring other churches can be healthy and help you to see that other people are truly following Jesus outside of the RCs. But you don't have to go if you don't want to. Again, don't push yourself to 'get over' the Revival Centres and the damage they may have done you. Relax. God understands you and your confusion. He is far more patient with us than we are with ourselves.
2/ If you leave then be prepared. You will probably lose all your friends there. It is extremely common for various rumours to circulate as to why you have left. Bad motives will likely be implied to you. Maligning ex-members / detractors is a common cult technique that is used to debase opposing views, as a part of mind control.
To counter this, some have suggested proper procedures for leaving a cult. A good way to leave the Revival Centres is as follows. Decide your reasons for leaving. Put these reasons in a letter, and send it to your friends and to the people in your home group. For instance, you may write something like:
"Dear Friend, I wanted to let you know personally of a big decision I have recently made. Over the last few years, I have found that I am not comfortable with some of the doctrines and practices of the Revival Centres, and for this reason I have made a final decision that I must leave. I am doing this because I care for the Lord and feel like I must serve him in a better way than is possible in the Revival Centres.
Yours Sincerely, X"
You will find that this may help to stop most of the rumours when you leave. You will also find that people still in the group may not be so hostile towards you. You may even find that you can help them to leave much more easily! We also love to hear when people leave. Please take a little time to send us a quick e-mail. We will not publish it without permission, but it is always good to hear when our site is effective.
|I WANT TO LEAVE, BUT I AM A BIT APREHENSIVE...|
We get this letter a lot. Sure, leaving can be difficult, but it's all a matter of trusting the Lord and having courage. Leaving is difficult, but the longer you stay the harder it becomes to leave.
If you sincerely decide to follow the Lord then know the Lord will look out for you. Jesus has been around a lot longer than the Revival Centres! 'You will never slip from his hand'. It's about trusting him, and knowing that he will see you right.
There are always people who don't mind talking this through with you. It may be useful to keep in touch with other ex-members through the Guestbook or Forum on this site as you go through the diffucult process of leaving.
|WHAT ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR VERSE HERE?|
We are constantly getting very similar e-mails along the lines of,
"You must receive the Spirit with the evidence of speaking in tongues. Romans 8:9 says that you must have the Spirit"
We are unable to get in to long doctrinal debates with everyone who writes. Since these e-mails are monotonously similar, we have put together pat answers to the standard Revival Centre arguments in our publication the Revival Centres Answered Verse by Verse. Please check that publication to see our position regarding the standard verses, as due to time constraints we are often only able to cut and paste it in response to a query anyway. Though, if you decide to move beyond the three or four verses that are usually taught in the Revival Centres, please bring them up with us. We would love to chat in that case, with anyone who is thinking for themselves.