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Date Posted:10/10/2008 4:21 AMCopy HTML

 Can someone give me a clear definition of the word "forensic" ?? Scouting around the net and one comes up with "forensic science",and "forensic psychology" but I find nothing to nut down the actual meaning of the word "forensic".. Is it a latin word in origin ??? The nearest I can come up with as a court procedure.....

Yep you guessed it, my focus is Romans 3:20 - 24smiley24

Disciple
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Re:Forensic

Date Posted:10/10/2008 4:38 AMCopy HTML

 Disciple,

This is about it :

forensic

The Concise Oxford Dictionary of English Etymology

forensic pert. to courts of law. XVII. f. L. forensis, f. forum; see FORUM, -IC.
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Re:Forensic

Date Posted:10/10/2008 4:40 AMCopy HTML

 And foythermoyre:

Etymology

The first teachers of oratory were the ancient Greeks and Romans, namely Aristotle and Cicero. When they were classifying "kinds" of oratory, they termed the kind of argument used in a court of law to prove or disprove past events "forensic" argumentation. Centuries later while universities were still teaching all the forms of argument, students decided to take it to the competitive level and began debating for sport in an activity they named "forensics." Today forensics includes competitive dramatics and public speaking.


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Re:Forensic

Date Posted:10/10/2008 5:02 AMCopy HTML

Young padawan,

Ah, yes. The imputation of Christ's righteousness in the forensic justification of the sinner by God  

Now, to very briefly consider a matter that would likely bore the average viewer of this site into a coma! As you would no doubt be aware, there's been something of a "paradigm shift" in scholarly opinion during the past few decades into whether or not the expression dikaiosune theou should be understood as a subjective genitive, or as an objective genitive. Properly comprehending the implications of this issue is, of course, absolutely crucial to grasping what Paul intended in your current passage!

Personally, and FWIW, I lean more towards the traditional (or so-called "Lutheran") understanding than I do to one or other of the various strands of thought commonly subsumed under the rubric, the "New Perspective". However, in admitting as much, Bishop N.T. Wright has put forward some fairly convincing arguments in support of his version of the latter! My recommendation to you would be to compare James Dunn's commentary on these verses in the WBC series, against Moo's in the NICNT. It might also be helpful to read some of Bishop Wright's views, helpfully collated and available at the following website: www.ntwrightpage.com
But are you having fun with Romans, old chap?

Blessings,

Ian
email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Re:Forensic

Date Posted:10/10/2008 11:27 AMCopy HTML

Reply to Didaktikon

Young padawan,

Ah, yes. The imputation of Christ's righteousness in the forensic justification of the sinner by God  

Now, to very briefly consider a matter that would likely bore the average viewer of this site into a coma! As you would no doubt be aware, there's been something of a "paradigm shift" in scholarly opinion during the past few decades into whether or not the expression dikaiosune theou should be understood as a subjective genitive, or as an objective genitive. Properly comprehending the implications of this issue is, of course, absolutely crucial to grasping what Paul intended in your current passage!

Personally, and FWIW, I lean more towards the traditional (or so-called "Lutheran") understanding than I do to one or other of the various strands of thought commonly subsumed under the rubric, the "New Perspective". However, in admitting as much, Bishop N.T. Wright has put forward some fairly convincing arguments in support of his version of the latter! My recommendation to you would be to compare James Dunn's commentary on these verses in the WBC series, against Moo's in the NICNT. It might also be helpful to read some of Bishop Wright's views, helpfully collated and available at the following website: www.ntwrightpage.com
But are you having fun with Romans, old chap?

Blessings,

Ian

Yes I am in the middle of preparing and researching an assignment on the atonement... But I have a summer intensive coming up in the last week of November on Romans and Pauline Theology - after that I have but two subjects remaining, namely Christology and Corinthians and then I am finally finished to BTh... Ta for that hint on James Dunn's commentary...

much obliged

Big E  
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Re:Forensic

Date Posted:10/10/2008 9:52 PMCopy HTML

Good morning, Eric.

If you need any help, just 'shout'. But I'm sort of hoping that you're seriously considering undertaking an honours year once you complete the BTh. And after a year or two of reflection, a MTh (or in the case of the SCD, a MTh with Honours)? Research has much to commend it! 

Blessings,

Ian

P.S. Oops, I should've added: and whatever you do, don't let the Hebrew and Greek slip! Basic proficiency in the languages was hard to come by but is easy to lose!

email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Re:Forensic

Date Posted:13/10/2008 11:20 AMCopy HTML

Reply to Didaktikon

Good morning, Eric.

If you need any help, just 'shout'. But I'm sort of hoping that you're seriously considering undertaking an honours year once you complete the BTh. And after a year or two of reflection, a MTh (or in the case of the SCD, a MTh with Honours)? Research has much to commend it! 

Blessings,

Ian

P.S. Oops, I should've added: and whatever you do, don't let the Hebrew and Greek slip! Basic proficiency in the languages was hard to come by but is easy to lose!


Hi Ian

I am sort of considering an honours year. I will have to do a research essay of 20,000 words. And I know this won't rub too well with you but I would like my area of specialisation to be Mystical Theology and that namely of St. Thomas Aquinas, Augustine of Hippo, St Bernard, and in particularly the collected works of the Spanish Mystic, St John of the Cross ( cf Dark Night of the Soul) . I have just completed research on the modern trappist monk Thomas Merton who incidently died the same day that Karl Barth did.!! The study of the great Catholic Contemplatives ---

Considering the classic clangers you and I had in the past, I guess you might not be suitably impressed
but nevertheless, maybe God is setting me up for a possible THD thesis one day

blessings old buddy

Eric
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Re:Forensic

Date Posted:13/10/2008 10:19 PMCopy HTML

Good morning, Eric.

I am sort of considering an honours year. I will have to do a research essay of 20,000 words. And I know this won't rub too well with you but I would like my area of specialisation to be Mystical Theology and that namely of St. Thomas Aquinas, Augustine of Hippo, St Bernard, and in particularly the collected works of the Spanish Mystic, St John of the Cross (cf Dark Night of the Soul).

Sure, but why did you think such a project wouldn't sit well with me? I'm all for the contemplative life, and the practice of the received spiritual disciplines (set prayer routines, meditation on the Psalter, etc). Personally, I think such a field would reap significant rewards; however, I would caution you against limiting yourself to studying just the Western tradition. The Eastern Church has a very significant contemplative tradition; further, they are intentionally pneumatological in their approach to such matters

I have just completed research on the modern trappist monk Thomas Merton who incidently died the same day that Karl Barth did.!! The study of the great Catholic Contemplatives ---

Yep. And both men were cut, more-or-less, from the same cloth.

Considering the classic clangers you and I had in the past, I guess you might not be suitably impressed but nevertheless, maybe God is setting me up for a possible  THD thesis one day.

Yes, but don't lose sight of the crucial point that our past conflict was based solely on the fact that you were a completely untethered and thoroughly subjective charismaniac at the time! Your engagement with theological and biblical studies through the years since, has tempered
this mania, to the extent that much of what you promoted back then, you wouldn't dream of promoting, now smiley9  But don't get too ahead of yourself just yet. You'll need to spend a few years reflecting on what you've learned to date, before you go launching off into the murky waters of doctoral studies. However, I would hope that you do, eventually, take the terminal degree!

Blessings, bro'.

Ian
email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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