Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Title: Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?
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Date Posted：18/06/2007 11:52 AMCopy HTML

Having just read a theory on alien abductions and studying the workings of the mind and how powerful it can be has led me to ask the questions...

" IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING."
Allyson Jones

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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：18/06/2007 11:52 AMCopy HTML

Having just read a theory on alien abductions and studying the workings of the mind and how powerful it can be has led me to ask the questions... What indeed is 'real' and what is 'all in the mind.' 
I'd really appreciate it if people could comment here about what they have experienced with God honestly and what it was that has them absolutely convinced beyond ANY shadow of doubt that it was from God and not something that perhaps the mind itself has conjoured up. Did you want the Holy Spirit SO bad and feared 'going to hell' so much that knowing without it, that is where you were destined to end up? Were you afraid you might not 'get' it? Have you ever, in quiet moments of thought, wondered if you DID actually receive it? Wondered if perhaps your mind had you convinced you had it?  I'm particularly interested to hear about any of you who actually 'spoke in tongues' without even being 'preached' too or knowing anything whatsoever about it. 
After reading all this about alien abductions..... will it cause you to re-think your beliefs? Or is that a 'too scary to even contemplate' question?. Lets face it. We are/or have been too scared from walking away from what we have been taught to believe. Scared to even contemplate that there might be another way. The more we open our eyes, the more we learn.
To those that open up honestly about God and their beliefs, I sincerely hope that your openess will not be ridiculed by others but that you might be open to others thoughts on the idea. Once again, without ridicule.
As far as alien abductions are concerned, I am very interested in the questions these tales raise about human nature and the distinction between sensationalism and science. What do we know about people who claim to be abducted by aliens? What standards or rules do we apply to sort out truth from fiction and decide whether we believe the 'kidnap victims'?
Many psychologists ( not me yet! ) have studied the reported 'alien kidnappings', and one of the conclusions is that the kidnappings never occurred. However, the people making the claims are not necessarily mentally ill, nor are they lying.. These are by and large people who have 'remembered' their 'experiences' while undergoing therapy, and often under hypnosis. Tales of alien abduction are widely known throughout our culture, so it is not at all suprising that the 'memories' of 'kidnap victims' would tend to coincide. 'Abductees' generally claim that they are awakened during their sleep by the aliens and are unable to move. We know that many of our voluntary muscles-the ones that involve movement- become 'paralyzed' when we sleep, which is why we usually don't thrash around when we dream. 'Hallucinations' - that is, seeing and hearing things that are not really there - are quite common as we are waking from a sleep-paralyzed state - ( I can't tell you the amount of times Ive sat bolt-upright in bed with my eyes wide open fighting of hundreds of spiders that are hanging around my face! lol! ) - and it seems the reported experiences of 'abductees' fit the pattern. People are quite open to suggestion, especially during hypnosis. Memories are not perfect snapshots. "UFO" memories may be constructed from bits and pieces of sleep-related hallucinations, nightmares and media attention fixed solidly into place with the suggestion of hypnosis and the validation of support groups. I guess the same could be said for those of us who have had various 'experiences' with God. Our conviction is further validated by those around us who have 'experienced' the same. Dare I suggest, brainwashing??
Whats your thoughts?
Bindi

" IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING."
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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：18/06/2007 3:13 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : bindi 

Having just read a theory on alien abductions and studying the workings of the mind and how powerful it can be has led me to ask the questions... What indeed is 'real' and what is 'all in the mind.'I'd really appreciate it if people could comment here about what they have experienced with God honestly and what it was that has them absolutely convinced beyond ANY shadow of doubt that it was from God and not something that perhaps the mind itself has conjoured up. Did you want the Holy Spirit SO bad and feared 'going to hell' so much that knowing without it, that iswhere you were destined to end up? Were you afraid you might not 'get' it?Have you ever, in quiet moments of thought, wondered if you DID actually receive it?Wondered ifperhaps your mind had you convinced you had it? I'm particularly interested to hear about any of you wh 

Hi bindi, I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God that may well have been chance or coincidence. However our son was born with a severe disability that included blindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help. My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see. I no of other similar things happening occaisionaly in other churches. I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault. I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and certainly not because you follow Noel Hollins version of being saved.

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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：18/06/2007 9:01 PMCopy HTML

Almost all of the 'experiences' that are attributed to God are pretty much as you say..........

Very real in the mind of the person who has the experience, but can easily be invalidated when subjected to rational scrutiny. But most people are too polite and never do challenge them. It's easier to just nod and allow the person to keep believing in their fantasies!

Dog.

"for there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 2, Scene 2)

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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：18/06/2007 9:36 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : prezy 


Hi bindi, I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God that may well have been chance or coincidence. However our son was born with a severe disability that included blindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help. My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see. I no of other similar things happening occaisionaly in other churches. I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault. I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and certainly not because you follow Noel Hollins version of being saved.  


Hi Prezy 
Thanks for your reply.
I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God that may well have been chance or coincidence. 
Yes... the same I think can be said for all of our affiliated churches. I don't know if you recall or read any of the posts in another thread.. either the Kevin Quirk topic or the Describe Your Perfect Church topic, but a few spoke honestly about healings and miracles in general. And it was discussed how much was 'put down to God' and like you mentioned here..how much was really down to just 'us' doing something about changing our situations or whether its coincidence. After all, it rains on the just and the unjust eh? It makes me wonder about all the 'miracles' that happen for people who have no 'religious' background or belief in a higher power as such. As my topic suggests, could the power of our mind heal us? Could the power of our own minds in fact deceive us as well?
However our son was born with a severe disability that included blindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help. My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see.
Wow! thats a pretty incredible miracle what happened to your son! Wonderful! Thanks for sharing it. How old was your son when he got his sight back? What did the doctors say afterwards? Did they do any scans on his brain again to see what had happened? Was your son old enough by that stage to have a 'faith' of his own? Please don't misunderstand me. My intention here is not to 'grill' you or discredit this healing. I'm just very interested to know. In my 14 years at the RF. I can't really recall any real big miracle healing that happened that couldn't be explained another way. I had a few 'healings' myself of minor things. But my curious mind now has me wondering if I, in fact, psyched myself into being healed. I am geniunely interested in hearing in detail REAL miracles. ( I don't know whether studying psychology is a good thing or a bad thing for me at the mo! LOL! Has me more confused about whats 'real' and what isn't! )
I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault.
Yes... well said. I think we all suffered terribley with condemnation if we didn't get 'healed' or 'blessed' in some way. Made to feel like we didn't have enough faith or something was 'wrong' with our walk. It, in our church anyway, was never 'said' in that way. But thats how you felt. 
I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and certainly not because you follow Noel Hollins version of being saved.  
Hmmm... I beg to differ there as doesn't the bible say that " By his stripes we WERE healed." ...Not... "By His stripes you MIGHT get healed. And  " Healing is the childrens bread" etc etc? Aren't Christians encouraged to believe that it is in fact the God given 'right' of Christians to be blessed and healed?
I recall a conversation with a fellow ex RF who's child had been stabbed. They were later contacted by another member of the RF and told.. " If you were in fellowship, this wouldn't of happened." I had to laugh at this as, ( and in fact, convince the poor parent that it was NOT because they had 'fallen away' that this happened! ) because if indeed they WERE still in the fellowship and this incident had occurred, the answer would of been different! The old.. " Ohh, its just a trial of your faith"!  Wasn't very 'christian' like encouragement for the poor parent I'm sure you would agree!
Anyway.. thanks again prezy. Would love to hear more in detail about your sons healing!!!
Regards.... Bindi 

" IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING."
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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：19/06/2007 4:14 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : bindi 

Reply to : prezyHi bindi, I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God thatmay well have been chance or coincidence. However our son was born with a severe disability that includedblindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help.My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see. I no of other similar things happening occaisionaly in other churches. I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault. I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and 

Hi Bindi,
              My son was about 9 months old if my memory serves me correctly when he gained his sight. We took him back to his neuroligist who was amazed, waved her hands up and said I dont know what youve done but it worked. He is now almost 5 and has some physical and intellectual disability but is going to kinder and walking and has some speech. Probably doesnt have much faith in God but did say amen once after we were praying.lol. Thanks for your interest.

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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：24/06/2007 10:30 AMCopy HTML

Reply to : bindi

Having just read a theory on alien abductions and studying the workings of the mind and how powerful it can be has led me to ask the questions... What indeed is 'real' and what is 'all in the mind.'I'd really appreciate it if people could comment here about what they have experienced with God honestly and what it was that has them absolutely convinced beyond ANY shadow of doubt that it was from God and not something that perhaps the mind itself has conjoured up. 

This was the line of thought I was going with in the 'lets talk about tongues' thread. It was interesting to hear about what people truly believed happened to them. I asked for no-bullshit stories, so I hope the stories were real and not attention seeking urban legends. I've never personally seen anything or experienced anything during my 35 years on the planet to make me think, "Strike-a-light, that is super-freaking-natural!". 

I used to write-off all the alien and ghost stories as Satan's little army of demons playing silly bugger with us. Those mischievous little minxes and their tricks. Crazy rascally little scallywags! Ahh, ya gotta love 'em. Christians would have us believe that all their crazy demon/angel/jesus sightings are above board, while the Mary/E.T./poltergeist sightings are induced by Mr Devil himself... the ultimate trickster. I have to say, that anyone who starts seeing mythological creatures in their own physical perepheral vision needs to really have a good long hard think about how much sleep they are getting and what unnatural substances they are allowing to seep through their lungs and stomach linings.

The bible has its own built-in clauses to explain away people like myself and that makes the whole thing work wonderfully. It would seem a strong delusion spell has been cast on me in order for me to believe a lie, and that I was 'not ever of them'. Whatever works for them, but I really think this is a cop out. If this delusion spell is on me then my freewill has been compromised and therefore my ability to work out my salvation has been biased and is not in my favour. That's a bit unfair don't you think?

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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：25/06/2007 8:10 AMCopy HTML

Hi Bindi,

              My son was about 9 months old if my memory serves me correctly when he gained his sight. We took him back to his neuroligist who was amazed, waved her hands up and said I dont know what youve done but it worked. He is now almost 5 and has some physical and intellectual disability but is going to kinder and walking and has some speech. Probably doesnt have much faith in God but did say amen once after we were praying.lol. Thanks for your interest.

This chat sound like a call in radio show on god. OK I'll talk.

So it's your son and it was the next day and you think that god did it and not just nature and time. But to me it sounds like god did a half ass job in his miracle. Why does you son still have physical and intellectual disabilities?  If god was working on your son he's not that good at his job. I believe that people WISH the story to be true and place the facts in order and in time to make this work. 

Things happen that are not of a god and people wish them to be of god. Even the Catholic Church does not believe in more that a few true miracles. And this is out of the billions of Catholics and not Catholics that have lived over the thousands of years.

"Until the philosophy that holds one race superior and another inferior is finally and permanently discredited and abandoned, then everywhere is war"

I"ve seen a lot of strange stuff, but I"ve never seen anything to make me believe there"s one all-powerful force controlling everything. There"s no mystical energy field controls my destiny.?

If there is a God I don"t like him
AND ALL THE PEOPLE SAID

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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：25/06/2007 10:30 AMCopy HTML

Reply to : Frank Spike and Moth and Rust 


Hi Bindi,My son was about 9 months old if my memory serves me correctly when he gained his sight. We took him back to his neuroligist who was amazed, waved her hands up and said I dont know what youve done but it worked. He is now almost 5 and has some physical and intellectual disability but is going to kinder and walking and has some speech. Probably doesnt have much faith in God but did say amen once after we were praying.lol. Thanks for your interest.This chat sound like a call in radio show on god. OK I'll talk.So it's your son and it was the next day and you think that god did it and not just nature and time. But to me it sounds like god did a half ass job in his miracle. Why does you son still have physical and intellectual disabilities? If god was working on your son he's not that good at his job. I believe that people WISH the story t 

 
Hi FS....
 I think this really is a question for Prezzy to answer of course being as its his son that got that healing on his eyes. However... The thought did indeed cross my mind as to why in fact God did not COMPLETELY heal his son. Its seems the miracle of sight has indeed been restored without explanation. That is for him to explain further. But, to me, it did seem in fact, a miracle in part albeit not a complete miracle of all physical and mental disabilities. 
In the churches, we were encouraged to give ALL praise to God for EVERYTHING. Even if it was in fact ourselves that had something to do with it. Whilst I will give credit where it is due, I won't discredit the involvement of ourselves. IE: The wonderful way our body has in repairing damage. Be it our immune system or our minds. Our body is a bloody amazing piece of machinery!!!!
To Moth....
Ahhh... THATS where this convo was started! I thought it was in either the "perfect Church" or the "PK" threads. I thought it deserved its own thread as its such an interesting, confronting topic and so started one here. Yes... I do agree. Our 'free will' has been somewhat compromised. I don't really believe there IS any such thing as 'free will'!  We were told... " You have a choice, its your free will, but if you don't do things THIS way, your going to hell and its not a nice place down there. Lots of screaming for all eternity. Burning sulpher. No chance of cooling off, no sirreee! But hey! Its your choice!" What the hell? ( pun intended ) What kind of choice is THAT???
As for seeing beasties, ghosts, gremlins and aliens. I believe its literally 'all in the mind'. Sometimes enhanced with a few mind expanding drugs if thats your thing! But seriously.... these 'things' can be explained away scientifically and therefor I don't believe it has anything to do with the workings of 'Ol' Nick' or is the souls of the dearly departed. Having said that...what about the stories we here of 'haunted houses' etc? Ive heard some spine tingling stories of peoples experiences in some old, old buildings with a history behind them. How do we explain this? Is this another case of rumours getting around about certain places, stories being told and we have those tales memorized in our minds so when we visit these places, we 'experience' the same??? Is it because we want to have our OWN ghosty stories to tell? Lets face it.. everyone loves a good ghosty story around the campfire!!! There is nothing worse when everyone else has a story to tell and are all excited about telling it and then we turn around and say.. " well, nothing happened to me." Ohhh... what a convo killer! You don't get to be part of all the excited hype! You're left out! No one likes to be left out so we conjour up our OWN story. Hense the reason why all those alien abductions tell a similar tale. They have heard it before and it becomes locked in their memory. The same can be said for similar stories being told in the churches. Some I truely believe may of been true, but some were 'over dramatized'. No one wanted to be 'left out' in giving an amazing testimony. Anything for a bit of attention.
Regards... Bindi

" IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING."
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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：25/06/2007 11:47 AMCopy HTML

Hi FS....

 I think this really is a question for Prezzy to answer of course being as its his son that got that healing on his eyes. However... The thought did indeed cross my mind as to why in fact God did not COMPLETELY heal his son. Its seems the miracle of sight has indeed been restored without explanation and Prezzy sent me a PM with a little more detail. Which I won't divulge here. That is for him to explain further. But, to me, it did seem in fact, a miracle albeit not a complete miracle of all physical and mental disabilities.

In the churches, we were encouraged to give ALL praise to God for EVERYTHING. Even if it was in fact ourselves that had something to do with it. Whilst I will give credit where is is due, I won't discredit the involvement of ourselves. IE: The wonderful way our body has in repairing damage. Be it our immune system or our minds. Our body is a bloody amazing piece of machinery!!!!

To Moth....

Ahhh... THATS where this convo was started! I thought it was in either the "perfect Church" or the "PK" threads. I thought it deserved its own thread as its such an interesting, confronting topic and so started one here. Yes... I do agree. Our 'free will' has been somewhat compromised. I don't really believe there IS any such thing as 'free will'!  We were told... " You have a choice, its your free will, but if you don't do things THIS way, your going to hell and its not a nice place down there. Lots of screaming for all eternity. Burning sulpher. No chance of cooling off, no sirreee! But hey! Its your choice!" What the hell? ( pun intended ) What kind of choice is THAT???

As for seeing beasties, ghosts, gremlins and aliens. I believe its literally 'all in the mind'. Sometimes enhanced with a few mind expanding drugs if thats your thing! But seriously.... these 'things' can be explained away scientifically and therefor I don't believe it has anything to do with the workings of 'Ol' Nick' or is the souls of the dearly departed. Having said that...what about the stories we here of 'haunted houses' etc? Ive heard some spine tingling stories of peoples experiences in some old, old buildings with a history behind them. How do we explain this? Is this another case of rumours getting around about certain places, stories being told and we have those tales memorized in our minds so when we visit these places, we 'experience' the same??? Is it because we want to have our OWN ghosty stories to tell? Lets face it.. everyone loves a good ghosty story around the campfire!!! There is nothing worse when everyone else has a story to tell and are all excited about telling it and then we turn around and say.. " well, nothing happened to me." Ohhh... what a convo killer! You don't get to be part of all the excited hype! You're left out! No one likes to be left out so we conjour up our OWN story. Hense the reason why all those alien abductions tell a similar tale. They have heard it before and it becomes locked in their memory. The same can be said for similar stories being told in the churches. Some I truely believe may of been true, but some were 'over dramatized'. No one wanted to be 'left out' in giving an amazing testimony. Anything for a bit of attention.

Regards... Bindi

Yes it's funny how ghosts are often described as looking like smoke like from a campfire. Hummmm

I was almost involved in a car accident and did all I could do to avoid it and saved my life and that of my girlfriend. That night I was told to give the glory to god. Well since I was the one that made the mistake that got us into the accident and I was the one to get us out why did god get the credit? 

Now if I have thrown up my hands and closed my eyes and did nothing and we avoid the semi from turning us into pink spray than I could see god at work. But god got the credit when it went well, and never gets the blame when it goes bad. That if just god's will not his fault.

"Until the philosophy that holds one race superior and another inferior is finally and permanently discredited and abandoned, then everywhere is war"

I"ve seen a lot of strange stuff, but I"ve never seen anything to make me believe there"s one all-powerful force controlling everything. There"s no mystical energy field controls my destiny.?

If there is a God I don"t like him
AND ALL THE PEOPLE SAID

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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：25/06/2007 12:44 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : Frank Spike 

Hi Bindi,My son was about 9 months old if my memory serves me correctly when he gained his sight. We took him back to his neuroligist who was amazed, waved her hands up and said I dont know what youve done but it worked. He is now almost 5 and has some physical and intellectual disability but is going to kinder and walking and has some speech. Probably doesnt have much faith in God but did say amen once after we were praying.lol. Thanks for your interest.This chat sound like a call in radio show on god. OK I'll talk.So it's your son and it was the next day and you think that god did it and not just nature and time. But to me it sounds like god did a half ass job in his miracle. Why does you son still have physical and intellectual disabilities? If god was working on your son he's not that good at his job. I believe that people WISH the story t 

Hi f.s. we asked God to restore my son's sight and he did. I think this is a complete miracle. His blindness was our thing we couldnt bare and it was fixed. We dont subscribe to the grc belief that being saved makes you imune to sickness etc. and it is your right and expectation to have an illness free life. Facts prove this to be rubbish. If for some reason you cant stand hearing good news accounts about God or any positive things about God and Christianity dont read them. You soon learn who on this forum has views that you can handle. There are contributers on here that I think are full of all sorts of s#*t so I scan over there posts, but believe all points of view should be welcomed perhaps with the exeption of cultish revival doctrine.

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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：25/06/2007 1:48 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : ALL
 
Just thought I'd reiterate a previous comment here for all to see once again....
To those that open up honestly about God and their beliefs, I sincerely hope that your openess will not be ridiculed by others but that you might be open to others thoughts on the idea. Once again, without ridicule.
This is a confronting topic now doubt and is going to raise hackles. My purpose for starting it back up was to genuinely give us ALL ( believers and non believers ) something to think about.
Perhaps if we disbelieve a statement that someone has made, we could 'argue the case' with a little more tact and diplomacy dare I say??? Just to spare any potential hurt? OMG! I'm doing a 'moddy'!!!
Hahahaha!
Regards.... Bindi

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Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：26/06/2007 12:28 AMCopy HTML

OK Bindi, I've thought a bit about your question.  Here's my blurb.........

In my teens, as I clumsily went about discovering the world and myself, I had a great curiosity about the nature of life and everything. In restrospect, my inquisitive mind tended to have a 'if there's smoke, there's gotta be fire' type outlook. That is, I quite readily believed (or at least entertained the possibility of) all sorts of paranormal or metaphysical phenomenon. I kind of flirted with a lot of various spititual concepts. At 14, I got into marijuana and later LSD. The mind-expanding effects of these (especially the acid) really blew my mind. But not just in a wreckless youthful way, more like a tool in the exploration of some of the mind-states that were possible. I was reading stuff by Aldous Huxley, Timothy Leary, and Carlos Casteneda, and still have some of those books. I still have a copy of 'the psychadelic experience' a sort of guide through various bardos, based on the 'Tibetan Book of the Dead'. 

So, I allowed myself to examine and contemplate all sorts of fantastic possibilities, and even espoused some of them. These days, after having emerged from around 17 years on the RF treadmill, I have a far more skeptical outlook, one that develops with age and life's lessons. There can be 'smoke' at every corner, but I don't go running to see the fire!

My inclination now, is to be open-minded about various possibilities, but to hold them up to the measure of rational thought and scientific evidence. I have looked very closely at the nature of the cosmos, its inherent truths and principles. If someone presents a theory or belief system, I tend to look at whether it corresponds with my experience of what is 'real'. If it is not, I'm not too ready to accept it, no matter how many people do a song and dance about the whole deal. 

This 'measure' when applied to the bible and the christian concept of god has had me convinced that its a lot of codswallop. Many of the concepts one must accept to fit into the 'believer' model are really absurd, and are no more believable than dragons, bunyips, spaghetti monsters and the likes. 

I have seen and experienced a lot and know how easy it can be to be caught up in the web of various belief systems. I have learned how our emotional state may make us vulnerable and amenable to be 'brainwashed' or 'hoodwinked' into all sorts of strange things, and how utterly we may be taken by them. The mind can be extremely powerful in making things that are really without substance become a powerful driving force in our lives. This goes beyond intelligence and other life skills that many may think would guard us from these delusions. 

Lately, I have seen and read a lot of info presented to support an atheistic point of view. As much as they present some of the most powerfully convincing arguments I've encountered, I have far too rich an inner spiritual life to attach myself to an atheistic belief system. There does seem to be a universal consciousness that we are all part of, a kind of cosmic link. This has been described by many cultures in different ways for thousands of years, and is in harmony with everything that I see and experience in the world around me. 

There are things that seem to manifest in all sorts of ways that are inexplicable. There are folk with extraordinary powers of clairvoyance and such. I reckon that some of these things force us to stretch the boundaries of what we define as 'real'. Things are only SUPERnatural when we set rigid boundaries of what is 'natural'. So, I allow myself a more flexible appreciation of what is true and real.

Hope that makes sense. I'm seriously feeling the brain-drain setting in now! 

Dog.

"for there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 2, Scene 2)

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Register：16/04/2007 1:26 AM

Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：26/06/2007 9:26 AMCopy HTML

Hi f.s. we asked God to restore my son's sight and he did. I think this is a complete miracle. His blindness was our thing we couldnt bare and it was fixed. We dont subscribe to the grc belief that being saved makes you imune to sickness etc. and it is your right and expectation to have an illness free life. Facts prove this to be rubbish. If for some reason you cant stand hearing good news accounts about God or any positive things about God and Christianity dont read them. You soon learn who on this forum has views that you can handle. There are contributers on here that I think are full of all sorts of s#*t so I scan over there posts, but believe all points of view should be welcomed perhaps with the exeption of cultish revival doctrine.

I'll make this simple

I don't believe in a god your god their god or any god.

And from reading what people have posted just today there would seem to be at least four gods mentioned. 

And of course all these gods are a Christian version of god as this is a western country and not Buddhist country. Or a Hindu country etc. So of course there is a slant towards a Christian god. 

So when you pray to YOUR god and only ask for eye site and not a complete healing and settle for this I have to wonder why you don't go back and ask for a follow up miracle and get a complete healing. Or don't you want to push god to far and have him take back what you say he's given you?

There is more proof there is no god that there is a god.

I had a T-shirt made up that says "THE THEORY OF GOD"

Yes I know it's good right? It's not a T-shirt that you would wear for a job interview nor to the bank for a loan but just to go shopping in and to the beach it's a great shirt. 

A guy said "that he did not like my T-shirt as he was a believer." So I ask him to prove that there's a god. His reaction was to say "that you have to have faith." " Just because you can't see the air it doesn't' mean that it's not there" WOW!  He's soooo insightful. Just because you can't see the air it doesn't mean it's not there"

Well he's right.

 And he followed this up with radio waves. Just because you can't see the radio waves it doesn't mean there not there." Again WOW!  So you have to have faith that air and radio waves are real...just like god.  So I said to him. "So a blind man must live a life of pure faith as nothing to him is ever real EVEN HE GETS HIT BY A BUS!" that's not real as he didn't see it coming. 

 So a faith of air, radio waves and god is the only proof that there they exist. Sure there are way to prove that there is air and radio waves but lets not think to hard as it makes some people's brains hurt.

PROVE TO ME THAT THERE IS A GOD AND I WILL FALL DOWN AND WORSHIP IT!

And when I dieeee and when I'm dead dead and gone There're be one child born to carry on to carry on.

"Until the philosophy that holds one race superior and another inferior is finally and permanently discredited and abandoned, then everywhere is war"

I"ve seen a lot of strange stuff, but I"ve never seen anything to make me believe there"s one all-powerful force controlling everything. There"s no mystical energy field controls my destiny.?

If there is a God I don"t like him
AND ALL THE PEOPLE SAID

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Register：27/02/2004 11:21 PM

Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：29/06/2007 12:02 PMCopy HTML

Michael Shermer Out of Body Experiment

Michael Shermer travels to Laurentian University in Sudbury, Canada, to strap on the "God Helmet" in neuroscientist Michael Persinger's lab that duplicates out-of-body experiences, near-death experiences, alien abductions, and other paranormal phenomena.

Instagram and Twitter: @mothpete

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From：Unknown
Register：22/02/2006 12:26 AM

Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues?

Date Posted：29/06/2007 8:00 PMCopy HTML

Cool,

They came to very much the conclusions that many of us have in this discussion.

Goes to show that we should reconsider how much we can read into some experiences we have had, (and their source).

Dog.

"for there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 2, Scene 2)

bindi
Rank：Regular Poster Score：3270 Posts：144 From：Unknown Register：10/09/2006 7:33 PM	Date Posted：18/06/2007 11:52 AMCopy HTML Having just read a theory on alien abductions and studying the workings of the mind and how powerful it can be has led me to ask the questions... " IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING." Allyson Jones
bindi	Share to: #1
Rank：Regular Poster Score：3270 Posts：144 From：Unknown Register：10/09/2006 7:33 PM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：18/06/2007 11:52 AMCopy HTML Having just read a theory on alien abductions and studying the workings of the mind and how powerful it can be has led me to ask the questions... What indeed is 'real' and what is 'all in the mind.' I'd really appreciate it if people could comment here about what they have experienced with God honestly and what it was that has them absolutely convinced beyond ANY shadow of doubt that it was from God and not something that perhaps the mind itself has conjoured up. Did you want the Holy Spirit SO bad and feared 'going to hell' so much that knowing without it, that is where you were destined to end up? Were you afraid you might not 'get' it? Have you ever, in quiet moments of thought, wondered if you DID actually receive it? Wondered if perhaps your mind had you convinced you had it? I'm particularly interested to hear about any of you who actually 'spoke in tongues' without even being 'preached' too or knowing anything whatsoever about it. After reading all this about alien abductions..... will it cause you to re-think your beliefs? Or is that a 'too scary to even contemplate' question?. Lets face it. We are/or have been too scared from walking away from what we have been taught to believe. Scared to even contemplate that there might be another way. The more we open our eyes, the more we learn. To those that open up honestly about God and their beliefs, I sincerely hope that your openess will not be ridiculed by others but that you might be open to others thoughts on the idea. Once again, without ridicule. As far as alien abductions are concerned, I am very interested in the questions these tales raise about human nature and the distinction between sensationalism and science. What do we know about people who claim to be abducted by aliens? What standards or rules do we apply to sort out truth from fiction and decide whether we believe the 'kidnap victims'? Many psychologists ( not me yet! ) have studied the reported 'alien kidnappings', and one of the conclusions is that the kidnappings never occurred. However, the people making the claims are not necessarily mentally ill, nor are they lying.. These are by and large people who have 'remembered' their 'experiences' while undergoing therapy, and often under hypnosis. Tales of alien abduction are widely known throughout our culture, so it is not at all suprising that the 'memories' of 'kidnap victims' would tend to coincide. 'Abductees' generally claim that they are awakened during their sleep by the aliens and are unable to move. We know that many of our voluntary muscles-the ones that involve movement- become 'paralyzed' when we sleep, which is why we usually don't thrash around when we dream. 'Hallucinations' - that is, seeing and hearing things that are not really there - are quite common as we are waking from a sleep-paralyzed state - ( I can't tell you the amount of times Ive sat bolt-upright in bed with my eyes wide open fighting of hundreds of spiders that are hanging around my face! lol! ) - and it seems the reported experiences of 'abductees' fit the pattern. People are quite open to suggestion, especially during hypnosis. Memories are not perfect snapshots. "UFO" memories may be constructed from bits and pieces of sleep-related hallucinations, nightmares and media attention fixed solidly into place with the suggestion of hypnosis and the validation of support groups. I guess the same could be said for those of us who have had various 'experiences' with God. Our conviction is further validated by those around us who have 'experienced' the same. Dare I suggest, brainwashing?? Whats your thoughts? Bindi " IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING." Allyson Jones
prezy	Share to: #2
Rank：Poster Venti II Score：7160 Posts：343 From：Scotland Register：06/02/2007 11:02 AM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：18/06/2007 3:13 PMCopy HTML Reply to : bindi Having just read a theory on alien abductions and studying the workings of the mind and how powerful it can be has led me to ask the questions... What indeed is 'real' and what is 'all in the mind.'I'd really appreciate it if people could comment here about what they have experienced with God honestly and what it was that has them absolutely convinced beyond ANY shadow of doubt that it was from God and not something that perhaps the mind itself has conjoured up. Did you want the Holy Spirit SO bad and feared 'going to hell' so much that knowing without it, that iswhere you were destined to end up? Were you afraid you might not 'get' it?Have you ever, in quiet moments of thought, wondered if you DID actually receive it?Wondered ifperhaps your mind had you convinced you had it? I'm particularly interested to hear about any of you wh Hi bindi, I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God that may well have been chance or coincidence. However our son was born with a severe disability that included blindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help. My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see. I no of other similar things happening occaisionaly in other churches. I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault. I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and certainly not because you follow Noel Hollins version of being saved. ¡uıɐƃɐ ʎɐqǝ ɯoɹɟ pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ƃuıʎnq ɹǝʌǝu
dogmafree	Share to: #3
Rank：Poster Venti III Score：9580 Posts：416 From：Unknown Register：22/02/2006 12:26 AM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：18/06/2007 9:01 PMCopy HTML Almost all of the 'experiences' that are attributed to God are pretty much as you say.......... Very real in the mind of the person who has the experience, but can easily be invalidated when subjected to rational scrutiny. But most people are too polite and never do challenge them. It's easier to just nod and allow the person to keep believing in their fantasies! Dog. "for there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 2, Scene 2)
bindi	Share to: #4
Rank：Regular Poster Score：3270 Posts：144 From：Unknown Register：10/09/2006 7:33 PM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：18/06/2007 9:36 PMCopy HTML Reply to : prezy Hi bindi, I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God that may well have been chance or coincidence. However our son was born with a severe disability that included blindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help. My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see. I no of other similar things happening occaisionaly in other churches. I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault. I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and certainly not because you follow Noel Hollins version of being saved. Hi Prezy Thanks for your reply. I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God that may well have been chance or coincidence. Yes... the same I think can be said for all of our affiliated churches. I don't know if you recall or read any of the posts in another thread.. either the Kevin Quirk topic or the Describe Your Perfect Church topic, but a few spoke honestly about healings and miracles in general. And it was discussed how much was 'put down to God' and like you mentioned here..how much was really down to just 'us' doing something about changing our situations or whether its coincidence. After all, it rains on the just and the unjust eh? It makes me wonder about all the 'miracles' that happen for people who have no 'religious' background or belief in a higher power as such. As my topic suggests, could the power of our mind heal us? Could the power of our own minds in fact deceive us as well? However our son was born with a severe disability that included blindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help. My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see. Wow! thats a pretty incredible miracle what happened to your son! Wonderful! Thanks for sharing it. How old was your son when he got his sight back? What did the doctors say afterwards? Did they do any scans on his brain again to see what had happened? Was your son old enough by that stage to have a 'faith' of his own? Please don't misunderstand me. My intention here is not to 'grill' you or discredit this healing. I'm just very interested to know. In my 14 years at the RF. I can't really recall any real big miracle healing that happened that couldn't be explained another way. I had a few 'healings' myself of minor things. But my curious mind now has me wondering if I, in fact, psyched myself into being healed. I am geniunely interested in hearing in detail REAL miracles. ( I don't know whether studying psychology is a good thing or a bad thing for me at the mo! LOL! Has me more confused about whats 'real' and what isn't! ) I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault. Yes... well said. I think we all suffered terribley with condemnation if we didn't get 'healed' or 'blessed' in some way. Made to feel like we didn't have enough faith or something was 'wrong' with our walk. It, in our church anyway, was never 'said' in that way. But thats how you felt. I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and certainly not because you follow Noel Hollins version of being saved. Hmmm... I beg to differ there as doesn't the bible say that " By his stripes we WERE healed." ...Not... "By His stripes you MIGHT get healed. And " Healing is the childrens bread" etc etc? Aren't Christians encouraged to believe that it is in fact the God given 'right' of Christians to be blessed and healed? I recall a conversation with a fellow ex RF who's child had been stabbed. They were later contacted by another member of the RF and told.. " If you were in fellowship, this wouldn't of happened." I had to laugh at this as, ( and in fact, convince the poor parent that it was NOT because they had 'fallen away' that this happened! ) because if indeed they WERE still in the fellowship and this incident had occurred, the answer would of been different! The old.. " Ohh, its just a trial of your faith"! Wasn't very 'christian' like encouragement for the poor parent I'm sure you would agree! Anyway.. thanks again prezy. Would love to hear more in detail about your sons healing!!! Regards.... Bindi " IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING." Allyson Jones
prezy	Share to: #5
Rank：Poster Venti II Score：7160 Posts：343 From：Scotland Register：06/02/2007 11:02 AM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：19/06/2007 4:14 PMCopy HTML Reply to : bindi Reply to : prezyHi bindi, I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God thatmay well have been chance or coincidence. However our son was born with a severe disability that includedblindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help.My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see. I no of other similar things happening occaisionaly in other churches. I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault. I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and Hi Bindi, My son was about 9 months old if my memory serves me correctly when he gained his sight. We took him back to his neuroligist who was amazed, waved her hands up and said I dont know what youve done but it worked. He is now almost 5 and has some physical and intellectual disability but is going to kinder and walking and has some speech. Probably doesnt have much faith in God but did say amen once after we were praying.lol. Thanks for your interest. ¡uıɐƃɐ ʎɐqǝ ɯoɹɟ pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ƃuıʎnq ɹǝʌǝu
MothandRust	Share to: #6
Rank：Forum Oracle Score：41550 Posts：1881 From：Australia Register：27/02/2004 11:21 PM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：24/06/2007 10:30 AMCopy HTML Reply to : bindi Having just read a theory on alien abductions and studying the workings of the mind and how powerful it can be has led me to ask the questions... What indeed is 'real' and what is 'all in the mind.'I'd really appreciate it if people could comment here about what they have experienced with God honestly and what it was that has them absolutely convinced beyond ANY shadow of doubt that it was from God and not something that perhaps the mind itself has conjoured up. This was the line of thought I was going with in the 'lets talk about tongues' thread. It was interesting to hear about what people truly believed happened to them. I asked for no-bullshit stories, so I hope the stories were real and not attention seeking urban legends. I've never personally seen anything or experienced anything during my 35 years on the planet to make me think, "Strike-a-light, that is super-freaking-natural!". I used to write-off all the alien and ghost stories as Satan's little army of demons playing silly bugger with us. Those mischievous little minxes and their tricks. Crazy rascally little scallywags! Ahh, ya gotta love 'em. Christians would have us believe that all their crazy demon/angel/jesus sightings are above board, while the Mary/E.T./poltergeist sightings are induced by Mr Devil himself... the ultimate trickster. I have to say, that anyone who starts seeing mythological creatures in their own physical perepheral vision needs to really have a good long hard think about how much sleep they are getting and what unnatural substances they are allowing to seep through their lungs and stomach linings. The bible has its own built-in clauses to explain away people like myself and that makes the whole thing work wonderfully. It would seem a strong delusion spell has been cast on me in order for me to believe a lie, and that I was 'not ever of them'. Whatever works for them, but I really think this is a cop out. If this delusion spell is on me then my freewill has been compromised and therefore my ability to work out my salvation has been biased and is not in my favour. That's a bit unfair don't you think? Instagram and Twitter: @mothpete
Frank Spike	Share to: #7
Rank：Member Score：1060 Posts：50 From：Unknown Register：16/04/2007 1:26 AM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：25/06/2007 8:10 AMCopy HTML Hi Bindi, My son was about 9 months old if my memory serves me correctly when he gained his sight. We took him back to his neuroligist who was amazed, waved her hands up and said I dont know what youve done but it worked. He is now almost 5 and has some physical and intellectual disability but is going to kinder and walking and has some speech. Probably doesnt have much faith in God but did say amen once after we were praying.lol. Thanks for your interest. This chat sound like a call in radio show on god. OK I'll talk. So it's your son and it was the next day and you think that god did it and not just nature and time. But to me it sounds like god did a half ass job in his miracle. Why does you son still have physical and intellectual disabilities? If god was working on your son he's not that good at his job. I believe that people WISH the story to be true and place the facts in order and in time to make this work. Things happen that are not of a god and people wish them to be of god. Even the Catholic Church does not believe in more that a few true miracles. And this is out of the billions of Catholics and not Catholics that have lived over the thousands of years. "Until the philosophy that holds one race superior and another inferior is finally and permanently discredited and abandoned, then everywhere is war" I"ve seen a lot of strange stuff, but I"ve never seen anything to make me believe there"s one all-powerful force controlling everything. There"s no mystical energy field controls my destiny.? If there is a God I don"t like him AND ALL THE PEOPLE SAID
bindi	Share to: #8
Rank：Regular Poster Score：3270 Posts：144 From：Unknown Register：10/09/2006 7:33 PM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：25/06/2007 10:30 AMCopy HTML Reply to : Frank Spike and Moth and Rust Hi Bindi,My son was about 9 months old if my memory serves me correctly when he gained his sight. We took him back to his neuroligist who was amazed, waved her hands up and said I dont know what youve done but it worked. He is now almost 5 and has some physical and intellectual disability but is going to kinder and walking and has some speech. Probably doesnt have much faith in God but did say amen once after we were praying.lol. Thanks for your interest.This chat sound like a call in radio show on god. OK I'll talk.So it's your son and it was the next day and you think that god did it and not just nature and time. But to me it sounds like god did a half ass job in his miracle. Why does you son still have physical and intellectual disabilities? If god was working on your son he's not that good at his job. I believe that people WISH the story t Hi FS.... I think this really is a question for Prezzy to answer of course being as its his son that got that healing on his eyes. However... The thought did indeed cross my mind as to why in fact God did not COMPLETELY heal his son. Its seems the miracle of sight has indeed been restored without explanation. That is for him to explain further. But, to me, it did seem in fact, a miracle in part albeit not a complete miracle of all physical and mental disabilities. In the churches, we were encouraged to give ALL praise to God for EVERYTHING. Even if it was in fact ourselves that had something to do with it. Whilst I will give credit where it is due, I won't discredit the involvement of ourselves. IE: The wonderful way our body has in repairing damage. Be it our immune system or our minds. Our body is a bloody amazing piece of machinery!!!! To Moth.... Ahhh... THATS where this convo was started! I thought it was in either the "perfect Church" or the "PK" threads. I thought it deserved its own thread as its such an interesting, confronting topic and so started one here. Yes... I do agree. Our 'free will' has been somewhat compromised. I don't really believe there IS any such thing as 'free will'! We were told... " You have a choice, its your free will, but if you don't do things THIS way, your going to hell and its not a nice place down there. Lots of screaming for all eternity. Burning sulpher. No chance of cooling off, no sirreee! But hey! Its your choice!" What the hell? ( pun intended ) What kind of choice is THAT??? As for seeing beasties, ghosts, gremlins and aliens. I believe its literally 'all in the mind'. Sometimes enhanced with a few mind expanding drugs if thats your thing! But seriously.... these 'things' can be explained away scientifically and therefor I don't believe it has anything to do with the workings of 'Ol' Nick' or is the souls of the dearly departed. Having said that...what about the stories we here of 'haunted houses' etc? Ive heard some spine tingling stories of peoples experiences in some old, old buildings with a history behind them. How do we explain this? Is this another case of rumours getting around about certain places, stories being told and we have those tales memorized in our minds so when we visit these places, we 'experience' the same??? Is it because we want to have our OWN ghosty stories to tell? Lets face it.. everyone loves a good ghosty story around the campfire!!! There is nothing worse when everyone else has a story to tell and are all excited about telling it and then we turn around and say.. " well, nothing happened to me." Ohhh... what a convo killer! You don't get to be part of all the excited hype! You're left out! No one likes to be left out so we conjour up our OWN story. Hense the reason why all those alien abductions tell a similar tale. They have heard it before and it becomes locked in their memory. The same can be said for similar stories being told in the churches. Some I truely believe may of been true, but some were 'over dramatized'. No one wanted to be 'left out' in giving an amazing testimony. Anything for a bit of attention. Regards... Bindi " IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING." Allyson Jones
Frank Spike	Share to: #9
Rank：Member Score：1060 Posts：50 From：Unknown Register：16/04/2007 1:26 AM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：25/06/2007 11:47 AMCopy HTML Hi FS.... I think this really is a question for Prezzy to answer of course being as its his son that got that healing on his eyes. However... The thought did indeed cross my mind as to why in fact God did not COMPLETELY heal his son. Its seems the miracle of sight has indeed been restored without explanation and Prezzy sent me a PM with a little more detail. Which I won't divulge here. That is for him to explain further. But, to me, it did seem in fact, a miracle albeit not a complete miracle of all physical and mental disabilities. In the churches, we were encouraged to give ALL praise to God for EVERYTHING. Even if it was in fact ourselves that had something to do with it. Whilst I will give credit where is is due, I won't discredit the involvement of ourselves. IE: The wonderful way our body has in repairing damage. Be it our immune system or our minds. Our body is a bloody amazing piece of machinery!!!! To Moth.... Ahhh... THATS where this convo was started! I thought it was in either the "perfect Church" or the "PK" threads. I thought it deserved its own thread as its such an interesting, confronting topic and so started one here. Yes... I do agree. Our 'free will' has been somewhat compromised. I don't really believe there IS any such thing as 'free will'! We were told... " You have a choice, its your free will, but if you don't do things THIS way, your going to hell and its not a nice place down there. Lots of screaming for all eternity. Burning sulpher. No chance of cooling off, no sirreee! But hey! Its your choice!" What the hell? ( pun intended ) What kind of choice is THAT??? As for seeing beasties, ghosts, gremlins and aliens. I believe its literally 'all in the mind'. Sometimes enhanced with a few mind expanding drugs if thats your thing! But seriously.... these 'things' can be explained away scientifically and therefor I don't believe it has anything to do with the workings of 'Ol' Nick' or is the souls of the dearly departed. Having said that...what about the stories we here of 'haunted houses' etc? Ive heard some spine tingling stories of peoples experiences in some old, old buildings with a history behind them. How do we explain this? Is this another case of rumours getting around about certain places, stories being told and we have those tales memorized in our minds so when we visit these places, we 'experience' the same??? Is it because we want to have our OWN ghosty stories to tell? Lets face it.. everyone loves a good ghosty story around the campfire!!! There is nothing worse when everyone else has a story to tell and are all excited about telling it and then we turn around and say.. " well, nothing happened to me." Ohhh... what a convo killer! You don't get to be part of all the excited hype! You're left out! No one likes to be left out so we conjour up our OWN story. Hense the reason why all those alien abductions tell a similar tale. They have heard it before and it becomes locked in their memory. The same can be said for similar stories being told in the churches. Some I truely believe may of been true, but some were 'over dramatized'. No one wanted to be 'left out' in giving an amazing testimony. Anything for a bit of attention. Regards... Bindi Yes it's funny how ghosts are often described as looking like smoke like from a campfire. Hummmm I was almost involved in a car accident and did all I could do to avoid it and saved my life and that of my girlfriend. That night I was told to give the glory to god. Well since I was the one that made the mistake that got us into the accident and I was the one to get us out why did god get the credit? Now if I have thrown up my hands and closed my eyes and did nothing and we avoid the semi from turning us into pink spray than I could see god at work. But god got the credit when it went well, and never gets the blame when it goes bad. That if just god's will not his fault. "Until the philosophy that holds one race superior and another inferior is finally and permanently discredited and abandoned, then everywhere is war" I"ve seen a lot of strange stuff, but I"ve never seen anything to make me believe there"s one all-powerful force controlling everything. There"s no mystical energy field controls my destiny.? If there is a God I don"t like him AND ALL THE PEOPLE SAID
prezy	Share to: #10
Rank：Poster Venti II Score：7160 Posts：343 From：Scotland Register：06/02/2007 11:02 AM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：25/06/2007 12:44 PMCopy HTML Reply to : Frank Spike Hi Bindi,My son was about 9 months old if my memory serves me correctly when he gained his sight. We took him back to his neuroligist who was amazed, waved her hands up and said I dont know what youve done but it worked. He is now almost 5 and has some physical and intellectual disability but is going to kinder and walking and has some speech. Probably doesnt have much faith in God but did say amen once after we were praying.lol. Thanks for your interest.This chat sound like a call in radio show on god. OK I'll talk.So it's your son and it was the next day and you think that god did it and not just nature and time. But to me it sounds like god did a half ass job in his miracle. Why does you son still have physical and intellectual disabilities? If god was working on your son he's not that good at his job. I believe that people WISH the story t Hi f.s. we asked God to restore my son's sight and he did. I think this is a complete miracle. His blindness was our thing we couldnt bare and it was fixed. We dont subscribe to the grc belief that being saved makes you imune to sickness etc. and it is your right and expectation to have an illness free life. Facts prove this to be rubbish. If for some reason you cant stand hearing good news accounts about God or any positive things about God and Christianity dont read them. You soon learn who on this forum has views that you can handle. There are contributers on here that I think are full of all sorts of s#*t so I scan over there posts, but believe all points of view should be welcomed perhaps with the exeption of cultish revival doctrine. ¡uıɐƃɐ ʎɐqǝ ɯoɹɟ pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ƃuıʎnq ɹǝʌǝu
bindi	Share to: #11
Rank：Regular Poster Score：3270 Posts：144 From：Unknown Register：10/09/2006 7:33 PM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：25/06/2007 1:48 PMCopy HTML Reply to : ALL Just thought I'd reiterate a previous comment here for all to see once again.... To those that open up honestly about God and their beliefs, I sincerely hope that your openess will not be ridiculed by others but that you might be open to others thoughts on the idea. Once again, without ridicule. This is a confronting topic now doubt and is going to raise hackles. My purpose for starting it back up was to genuinely give us ALL ( believers and non believers ) something to think about. Perhaps if we disbelieve a statement that someone has made, we could 'argue the case' with a little more tact and diplomacy dare I say??? Just to spare any potential hurt? OMG! I'm doing a 'moddy'!!! Hahahaha! Regards.... Bindi " IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING." Allyson Jones
dogmafree	Share to: #12
Rank：Poster Venti III Score：9580 Posts：416 From：Unknown Register：22/02/2006 12:26 AM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：26/06/2007 12:28 AMCopy HTML OK Bindi, I've thought a bit about your question. Here's my blurb......... In my teens, as I clumsily went about discovering the world and myself, I had a great curiosity about the nature of life and everything. In restrospect, my inquisitive mind tended to have a 'if there's smoke, there's gotta be fire' type outlook. That is, I quite readily believed (or at least entertained the possibility of) all sorts of paranormal or metaphysical phenomenon. I kind of flirted with a lot of various spititual concepts. At 14, I got into marijuana and later LSD. The mind-expanding effects of these (especially the acid) really blew my mind. But not just in a wreckless youthful way, more like a tool in the exploration of some of the mind-states that were possible. I was reading stuff by Aldous Huxley, Timothy Leary, and Carlos Casteneda, and still have some of those books. I still have a copy of 'the psychadelic experience' a sort of guide through various bardos, based on the 'Tibetan Book of the Dead'. So, I allowed myself to examine and contemplate all sorts of fantastic possibilities, and even espoused some of them. These days, after having emerged from around 17 years on the RF treadmill, I have a far more skeptical outlook, one that develops with age and life's lessons. There can be 'smoke' at every corner, but I don't go running to see the fire! My inclination now, is to be open-minded about various possibilities, but to hold them up to the measure of rational thought and scientific evidence. I have looked very closely at the nature of the cosmos, its inherent truths and principles. If someone presents a theory or belief system, I tend to look at whether it corresponds with my experience of what is 'real'. If it is not, I'm not too ready to accept it, no matter how many people do a song and dance about the whole deal. This 'measure' when applied to the bible and the christian concept of god has had me convinced that its a lot of codswallop. Many of the concepts one must accept to fit into the 'believer' model are really absurd, and are no more believable than dragons, bunyips, spaghetti monsters and the likes. I have seen and experienced a lot and know how easy it can be to be caught up in the web of various belief systems. I have learned how our emotional state may make us vulnerable and amenable to be 'brainwashed' or 'hoodwinked' into all sorts of strange things, and how utterly we may be taken by them. The mind can be extremely powerful in making things that are really without substance become a powerful driving force in our lives. This goes beyond intelligence and other life skills that many may think would guard us from these delusions. Lately, I have seen and read a lot of info presented to support an atheistic point of view. As much as they present some of the most powerfully convincing arguments I've encountered, I have far too rich an inner spiritual life to attach myself to an atheistic belief system. There does seem to be a universal consciousness that we are all part of, a kind of cosmic link. This has been described by many cultures in different ways for thousands of years, and is in harmony with everything that I see and experience in the world around me. There are things that seem to manifest in all sorts of ways that are inexplicable. There are folk with extraordinary powers of clairvoyance and such. I reckon that some of these things force us to stretch the boundaries of what we define as 'real'. Things are only SUPERnatural when we set rigid boundaries of what is 'natural'. So, I allow myself a more flexible appreciation of what is true and real. Hope that makes sense. I'm seriously feeling the brain-drain setting in now! Dog. "for there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 2, Scene 2)
Frank Spike	Share to: #13
Rank：Member Score：1060 Posts：50 From：Unknown Register：16/04/2007 1:26 AM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：26/06/2007 9:26 AMCopy HTML Hi f.s. we asked God to restore my son's sight and he did. I think this is a complete miracle. His blindness was our thing we couldnt bare and it was fixed. We dont subscribe to the grc belief that being saved makes you imune to sickness etc. and it is your right and expectation to have an illness free life. Facts prove this to be rubbish. If for some reason you cant stand hearing good news accounts about God or any positive things about God and Christianity dont read them. You soon learn who on this forum has views that you can handle. There are contributers on here that I think are full of all sorts of s#*t so I scan over there posts, but believe all points of view should be welcomed perhaps with the exeption of cultish revival doctrine. I'll make this simple I don't believe in a god your god their god or any god. And from reading what people have posted just today there would seem to be at least four gods mentioned. And of course all these gods are a Christian version of god as this is a western country and not Buddhist country. Or a Hindu country etc. So of course there is a slant towards a Christian god. So when you pray to YOUR god and only ask for eye site and not a complete healing and settle for this I have to wonder why you don't go back and ask for a follow up miracle and get a complete healing. Or don't you want to push god to far and have him take back what you say he's given you? There is more proof there is no god that there is a god. I had a T-shirt made up that says "THE THEORY OF GOD" Yes I know it's good right? It's not a T-shirt that you would wear for a job interview nor to the bank for a loan but just to go shopping in and to the beach it's a great shirt. A guy said "that he did not like my T-shirt as he was a believer." So I ask him to prove that there's a god. His reaction was to say "that you have to have faith." " Just because you can't see the air it doesn't' mean that it's not there" WOW! He's soooo insightful. Just because you can't see the air it doesn't mean it's not there" Well he's right. And he followed this up with radio waves. Just because you can't see the radio waves it doesn't mean there not there." Again WOW! So you have to have faith that air and radio waves are real...just like god. So I said to him. "So a blind man must live a life of pure faith as nothing to him is ever real EVEN HE GETS HIT BY A BUS!" that's not real as he didn't see it coming. So a faith of air, radio waves and god is the only proof that there they exist. Sure there are way to prove that there is air and radio waves but lets not think to hard as it makes some people's brains hurt. PROVE TO ME THAT THERE IS A GOD AND I WILL FALL DOWN AND WORSHIP IT! And when I dieeee and when I'm dead dead and gone There're be one child born to carry on to carry on. "Until the philosophy that holds one race superior and another inferior is finally and permanently discredited and abandoned, then everywhere is war" I"ve seen a lot of strange stuff, but I"ve never seen anything to make me believe there"s one all-powerful force controlling everything. There"s no mystical energy field controls my destiny.? If there is a God I don"t like him AND ALL THE PEOPLE SAID
MothandRust	Share to: #14
Rank：Forum Oracle Score：41550 Posts：1881 From：Australia Register：27/02/2004 11:21 PM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：29/06/2007 12:02 PMCopy HTML Michael Shermer Out of Body Experiment Michael Shermer travels to Laurentian University in Sudbury, Canada, to strap on the "God Helmet" in neuroscientist Michael Persinger's lab that duplicates out-of-body experiences, near-death experiences, alien abductions, and other paranormal phenomena. Instagram and Twitter: @mothpete
dogmafree	Share to: #15
Rank：Poster Venti III Score：9580 Posts：416 From：Unknown Register：22/02/2006 12:26 AM	Re：Ever been abducted by aliens or spoken in tongues? Date Posted：29/06/2007 8:00 PMCopy HTML Cool, They came to very much the conclusions that many of us have in this discussion. Goes to show that we should reconsider how much we can read into some experiences we have had, (and their source). Dog. "for there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 2, Scene 2)