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MothandRust
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Date Posted:29/07/2007 10:49 PMCopy HTML

Well biggirl, you went to a church recently.

I hope my Hill$ong video didn't taint you too much (see below).

Why did you go? curiousity? Craving community? Somewhere to belong? Bored? Everyone has different reasons I suppose.

Church... here's a thing for those of us who were hung onto tongues to 'prove' our Christianity. The bible does not make going to church a requirement for being a christian either. The New testament church itself was not something peoplewentto.... it was something theywere.

You don't need to go to church. You don't need to give up your Sunday morning to congregate with what you percieve to be the body of Christ or part thereof. Whether it is or it isn't doesn't mean youhavetosit in rows with the sheep.

It is usually something that burdens you with guilt if you attend it and burdens you with guilt if you miss it. Modern day christendom has held on tight to the law of the Sabbath. uh-huh... Sunday... the 'holy' day. Mostly because of convenience, but there it is.

The church service in all of its passivityitself is not bringing you a whole lot closer to god. What most people there call 'worship' is not really worshipful. Your body is not a living sacrifice whilst you hold your hands up to the lightbulbs (Newsflash... He's not up there, the bible god lives within). Guilt is layed on you by people who like to be seen at church and want you to sit in rows with them while either yawning through hymns or trying to compete in power-songs. Then cometh the sermons that have little to do with reality and how to deal with a needy world full of pain other than to pray for them in a magic group think tank.

Sure, there are multi-media light shows and powerpoint blahs but the declining numbers of church attending Christians are not getting spiritually satisfied by these stage shows and are leaving exponentially. This big hole in people's time on a sunday morning where your precious time is separated from your family while the kids are in sunday school lessons etc are driven mainly by their favourite verse...Heb 10 :25 "Let's not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing".

This scripture is not demanding that you go to a church... or meeting for music... or praying in giant groups... or listening to lectures. It's not. Don't stop meeting together... do that as much as possible in the spirit of community and love as suggested over and over, buidling up in personal relationships and encouragement.Go to a coffee shop with friends... talk online in a forum... 'Going to church' is a routine of program-driven attendance controlled by the handfull of know-it-alls up the front. A place for doctrines to be sold. It's all about bodies in buildings for a few hours.... then herd 'em out after they've said the sinners prayer and fallen over or some stupid thing.

The real church of the bible is the one going on 'outside' of those expensively run money pits. You don't have to be a 'member' of a church, partaking in a formulaic ritualistic series of ceremoniesto be a Christian. Do you have to accept the doctrine of 'said' church to fit in? Do you need to hear a weekly lecture from some dude who has opinions.. learned though they may be in their particular brand?It's impersonal and you have to convince yourself that the cheesy set up is actually fun. It's an educational environment without any of the real educational processes that we as modern teachers know don't actually send a message into the brain's schema and long term learning.

A vulnerable conversation with a close friend will be more godly and nourishing than a cold talk from one person to a several hundred nodders. Break the mold... these churches dont change from the way they are because the formula is tight and the leaders believe it's the way god wants it and it generates cash flow.
[LINK SiteName=Mothrust: Movies and Modern Myth Target=_blank]http://aintchristian.blogspot.com.au/[/LINK] Be nice, for everyone that you meet is fighting a harder battle - Anita Roddick
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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:30/07/2007 12:57 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : MothandRust

Well biggirl, you went to a church recently.....The bible does not make going to church a requirement for being a christian either. The New testament church itself was not something people went to.... it was something they were.


Hi Mothman

I couldn't agree more, church is not a place, is not a building, is not where we ' go' to worship God.  It is WHO WE ARE!  Those of us who are Christians know that WE are the church, the body of Christ. And coincidentally, the talk I heard on Sunday was all about ' friends' and how friends can be very powerful influences on our lives.  I won't bother you any further with the details as it could be seen as ' preaching'  but just thought it was rather coincidental that you mentioned  A vulnerable conversation with a close friend will be more godly and nourishing.

Urch

Your unfailing love, O Lord, is as vast as the heavens; your faithfulness reaches beyond the clouds. Your righteousness is like the mighty mountains, your justice like the ocean depths.
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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:30/07/2007 1:55 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : Sea Urchin

 I won't bother you any further with the details as it could be seen as ' preaching'

Funnily enough, I think I was preaching.

Dunno, fine line. I'm challenging the 'concept' of the Sunday morning herding process... throwing it out there seeing it was drilled into us for so long. Sometimes we continue in a lot of thinking processes that are unchallenged as we hold onto a lot of 'isms' that we take for granted as 'gospel'.

I've always thought church was boring... even the camped up meetings... it was the socialising afterwards that felt real.

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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:30/07/2007 3:41 PMCopy HTML

ya moth man absolutly no prob's with this post my friend, couldnt agree with you more, mE  I choose to go to church cause I want to, not to feel more saved etc , just because I enjoy it, nothing more nothing less. there are many out there who no longer go to "a Church" for many varies reasons, there call not mine. I have chosen without guilt or fear  to sometimes just not go, its nice to have the freedom

earth5

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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:30/07/2007 4:44 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : MothandRust



Well biggirl, you went to a church recently. I hope my Hill$ong video didn't taint you too much (see below). Why did you go? curiousity? Craving community? Somewhere to belong? Bored?





I went because my husband still goes to church and was taking someone there. Also a friend of mine wanted to go again. I also thought I'd say hello to Urchin (HI urchin!)

My daughter also goes to a Uniting Church, and is signed up to help run the Sunday School. i would like to feel I could go every now and then and meet her friends, and be able to sit in a church. I don't believe any more that I have to beg for forgiveness from Jesus, and I don't believe he demands us to worship him. I don't think he needs his ego massaged.

Simple neighborhood churches uphold the teachings of Jesus (in the red lettering) I think thats all part of the Universal laws.

The tennis club fulfills my need for community more than adequately. Have met some great friends there!
MothandRust Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #5
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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:30/07/2007 7:59 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : big girl

What the hell could Moth be talking about?

The image

[LINK SiteName=Mothrust: Movies and Modern Myth Target=_blank]http://aintchristian.blogspot.com.au/[/LINK] Be nice, for everyone that you meet is fighting a harder battle - Anita Roddick
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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:24/08/2007 8:28 AMCopy HTML

Reply to : OTR

Simple neighborhood churches uphold the teachings of Jesus (in the red lettering) I think thats all part of the Universal laws.Hi big girl,I personally go along with you on this one.

Interesting term Universal.

Are you aware that in the Nicean Crede of 325 AD the Catholic or Universal Church was used. As apposed to Roman Catholic (franchised name).

Guys I'm sorry but just going along? What's your calling do you have one?

Whats my point? I believe we lost much of the outworking power signs of the Holy Ghost very soon after the death of the last of the apostles. The body of Christ the true church did in fact go into ther dark ages.

Christs truth is going to win the day though and it appears there have been many rumblings of that as men and women died for the cause of truth down through the ages 1400's & 1500's saw many martryrs for the actual true word.

1500's Just to get the word of God back to common local languages and dialects was a hard won battle.

1600's Anabaptists Ana (again) saw the reintroduction of baptism in it's original (are you of understanding?) useage.

!700's a new style of preaching and a major challenge to the congregations to know the bibles and become active and stop giving power away to the clergy. Move in God get active, seek him, read pray, talk about God.

1800's (late)  the first manifestations of the early signs and gifts coming back.

1900's Welsh revivals, Azusa Revivals, Indian Revival- healing and yes tongues were just some of the things the church was see again for the first time in 1800 years. Ever wondered why they called them the dark ages

The late part of the century saw some of the reformer churches start to take hold of this (most were happy to be called reformed and be content with there break from Rome and what they'd achieved though-the Bible in print, an active laity, baptism, outdoor camp meeting,). Stuck a flag over the door declaring the battle won (I'm a baptist, I'm a lutheran, and I'm a Uninting, see how rediculous it all is, name a name a go find the historical battle fought and won. oh and of course, I'm a Revival Centre ---- Really, then where's the revival?). (not the victory just a minor skirmish in ther scheme of the real battle going on).

God has other things in mind as he continues to restablish his CHURCH, so he's moving on and the earlier gifts and calling of God are coming back.

Heard any Prophecy lately, seen some miracles, had a healing, what those things aren't taught at your church, Isn't it funny that those who were the most aggresive in the original reformation have been (were) the most resistant to God's move. STUCK

So why all the diatribe? God is moving, his fullness is unfolding, many of the church organizations that are resisting are sounding there own death bells. The name over the door wan't cut it , it never did (I'm of Paul , I'm of Apollis) Baptist, Lutheran, Pentecostal, Catholic, Uniting.bla bla bla RF bla bla

My answer. Floating along a visit here a visit there I'm sorry Christ is winning victories for his body (the CHURCH) left right and centre, he's on the move. His Church is alive and on the move. Go seek out an active member of the BODY and go in and see what your calling is!

By all means go check them all out and ask are they battle weary for the ongoing fight for the full manifestation of the Kingdom and the sons of God or are they waving a banner from a battle fought and won in 1700, 1800, or perhaps a remnant of the glorious Revival of the 1900's as powerfaul men of God, like Wigleworth charged across the world, healing, baptising in water and power of the Spirit of God readying more for the battle.

Oh yes a battle and the forum is full of the battle weary, so what are you going to do?

Pick up your bat and ball and go sulk? oh no I'm fine I'll just pop down to the local church now and again and let the preacher wash me words from the red letter addition. oops , It's out.

I suggest you open your eyes and ears and go get your hands dirty, ask God to direct your path and get amongst it. What did Jesus say "By this shall all men Know that you are my disciples, if you have love one for the other".

Find a community of believers go get along side fight the fight support and love them while doing the work.

All in Love dear saints. All in love.

Bring it on!

 

 

 

 

 

 

it is the glory of God to conceal a matter but the honour of kings to search it out.
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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:24/08/2007 9:37 AMCopy HTML

Reply to : franks ghost

Reply to : OTRSimple neighborhood churches uphold the teachings of Jesus (in the red lettering) I think thats all part of the Universal laws.Hi big girl,I personally go along with you on this one.Interesting term Universal.Are you aware that in the Nicean Crede of 325 AD the Catholic orUniversalChurch was used. As apposed to Roman Catholic (franchised name).Guys I'm sorry but just going along? What's your calling do you have one?Whats my point? I believe we lost much of the outworking power signs of the Holy Ghost very soon after the death of the last of the apostles. The body of Christ the true church did in fact go into ther dark ages.Christs truth is going to win the day though and it appears th

wow frankie, well written my friend, great to catch up yesterday and last night

cu you again soon

earth5

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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:24/08/2007 9:49 AMCopy HTML

Reply to : franks ghost

Reply to : OTRSimple neighborhood churches uphold the teachings of Jesus (in the red lettering) I think thats all part of the Universal laws.Hi big girl,I personally go along with you on this one.Interesting term Universal.Are you aware that in the Nicean Crede of 325 AD the Catholic orUniversalChurch was used. As apposed to Roman Catholic (franchised name).Guys I'm sorry but just going along? What's your calling do you have one?Whats my point? I believe we lost much of the outworking power signs of the Holy Ghost very soon after the death of the last of the apostles. The body of Christ the true church did in fact go into ther dark ages.Christs truth is going to win the day though and it appears th

Thankyou Judge Frank,

Still got that Revivalist mindset. !

OTR

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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:24/08/2007 10:04 AMCopy HTML

Reply to : OTR

Reply to : franks ghostReply to : OTRSimple neighborhood churches uphold the teachings of Jesus (in the red lettering) I think thats all part of the Universal laws.Hi big girl,I personally go along with you on this one.Interesting term Universal.Are you aware that in the Nicean Crede of 325 AD the Catholic orUniversalChurch was used. As apposed to Roman Catholic (franchised name).Guys I'm sorry but just going along? What's your calling do you have one?Whats my point? I believe we lost much of the outworking power signs of the Holy Ghost very soon after the death of the last of the apostles. The body of Christ the true church did in fact go into ther dark ages.Christs truth is going to win the day though and it appears thThankyou Judge Frank,Still got that Rev

actually OTR, he hasnt, seems you are doing the judging

earth5

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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:24/08/2007 10:53 AMCopy HTML

Reply to : earth5

Reply to : OTRReply to : franks ghostReply to : OTRSimple neighborhood churches uphold the teachings of Jesus (in the red lettering) I think thats all part of the Universal laws.Hi big girl,I personally go along with you on this one.Interesting term Universal.Are you aware that in the Nicean Crede of 325 AD the Catholic orUniversalChurch was used. As apposed to Roman Catholic (franchised name).Guys I'm sorry but just going along? What's your calling do you have one?Whats my point? I believe we lost much of the outworking power signs of the Holy Ghost very soon after the death of the last of the apostles. The body of Christ the true church did in fact go into ther dark ages.Christs truth is going to win the day though and it appears thThankyou Judge Frank,Still got that Rev

Hi earth,

I preach so much about not reading into, but seeing what is being said. Perhaps I am guilty of just that. What I get from the statement above was that FG was saying there is no power in these Churches, because they don't have any outward signs. Though I do not fellowship at the moment, (still sitting on the fence) I see that  there are members of the body of Christ in those groups. If you need outward "signs" you will find that people are more compassionate and  understanding of others needs than you will ever find in Revival Centres. It is the love of God by the Holy Spirit working in believers through the Blood of Jesus, not an outward show.

The way I see it at the moment, some are called to be patricular servants (slaves) for the Lords work, where others become deciples (followers).  All have "power", only believe. 

OTR

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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:24/08/2007 1:06 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : OTR

Reply to : earth5Reply to : OTRReply to : franks ghostReply to : OTRSimple neighborhood churches uphold the teachings of Jesus (in the red lettering) I think thats all part of the Universal laws.Hi big girl,I personally go along with you on this one.Interesting term Universal.Are you aware that in the Nicean Crede of 325 AD the Catholic orUniversalChurch was used. As apposed to Roman Catholic (franchised name).Guys I'm sorry but just going along? What's your calling do you have one?Whats my point? I believe we lost much of the outworking power signs of the Holy Ghost very soon after the death of the last of the apostles.The body of Christ the true church did in fact go into ther dark ages.Christs truth is going to win the day though and it appears thThankyou Judge Frank,Still got that Rev

otr, what fg is saying is that over the course of the centuries that as people stumble upon another truth that has dissapeared over the years comes back , ie the lutherens faught against baptisim with anabaptist etc etc etc as it draws closer to Gods return we come to realise that there where things in the apostle's days that are no longer happening in the church and that they should be, hi is the God of yesterday today and forever, and his word dosent change.

It seems that those who recieved the last truth of scripture are the ones that fight what is reveled to the next generation ie end of the 1900s and early 20th century baptisim of the holy spirit was "rediscovered" and it was proberly the anabaptist that faught this.

OTF, Franks Ghost is really on a journey of dicovery and is really opening up to what the body of christ is all about and is excited about what god is showing him.

hope my ramblings make sense

earth5

 

 

 

 

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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:24/08/2007 4:44 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : earth5

Reply to : OTRReply to : earth5Reply to : OTRReply to : franks ghostReply to : OTRSimple neighborhood churches uphold the teachings of Jesus (in the red lettering) I think thats all part of the Universal laws.Hi big girl,I personally go along with you on this one.Interesting term Universal.Are you aware that in the Nicean Crede of 325 AD the Catholic orUniversalChurch was used. As apposed to Roman Catholic (franchised name).Guys I'm sorry but just going along? What's your calling do you have one?Whats my point? I believe we lost much of the outworking power signs of the Holy Ghost very soon after the death of the last of the apostles.The body of Christ the true church did in fact go into ther dark ages.Christs truth is going to win the day though and it appears thThankyou Judge Frank,Still got that Rev

Sure earth, I catch what you are saying. I have read many articles myself and found the same things as Frank. We live in an awesome age of information available to us and is mind boggling. We can stand before any church today and still not see in it any comparison to the first believers. I guess it comes down to ones own attitude to the Lord and in the end, the hope of being gathered up together with those of the promise, regardless of what church (congregation) we might attend or where ever one might be in the world.  

OTR     

  

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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:24/08/2007 6:59 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : OTR
Sure earth, I catch what you are saying. I have read many articles myself and found the same things as Frank. We live in an awesome age of information available to us and is mind boggling. We can stand before any church today and still not see in it any comparison to the first believers. I guess it comes down to ones own attitude to the Lord and in the end, the hope of being gathered up together with those of the promise, regardless of what church (congregation) we might attend or where ever one might be in the world

Hey there otr,, absolutely ,nothing will be the same as the1st church, and no one place has it all right, I think that is what FG is also saying re dosent matter the name over the door

nothin perfect until that which is perfect has come.

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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:24/08/2007 10:36 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : earth5

............................nothing perfect until that which is perfect has come.

Thanks earth and Frank.

Just for interest, are you quoting from 1 Corinthians 13:10, when the perfect  (i.e. 'love') comes, or referring to Jesus at his return?

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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:25/08/2007 11:31 AMCopy HTML

Reply to : OTR

Reply to : earth5............................nothingperfect untilthat which is perfect has come.Thanks earth and Frank.Just for interest, are you quoting from 1 Corinthians 13:10,when the perfect (i.e. 'love')comes, or referring to Jesus at hisreturn?
jesus
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Re:Do Christians have to go to church?

Date Posted:26/08/2007 5:14 PMCopy HTML

Reply to : OTR


well OTR seems you and Earth have sorted it all out.

No judging intended my friend just some hard core self evaluation flowing over to the forum.

Pilgrims progress.

it is the glory of God to conceal a matter but the honour of kings to search it out.
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