Hello Viking1

thanks for posting,  great to have  your contribution

I don' t know your status -if you've left CAI (recently or otherwise) or not.
..  hopefully you`ve  made the dash for the  border (or are thinking about leaving or areat least open minded to question a few things) … well done if

A) you have left, 

B)  can think about leaving or question things.

C)  ...if you haven`t, hopefully  in the nearfuture you`ll be slightly more open – we are extraordinarily narrow-minded in the CAI.  

I believe the  CAI  has been  beneficial to  people (but in  very limited way) – there are several  members ( may be yourself too)  who have  battled addiction or  similar, and havefound  hope and deliverance via the CAI.

This is  a genuine  experience. 

The circumstances in thesepeoples’  lives led them to the CAI, but also creates  a very real  and strong bond tothe  CAI.

I knew a few in theassembly  who similarly  were set free from drugs  or other addictions.

I  thinks these were/are inspirational good-newsstories  (unfortunately they give the CAI  credibility)

 I hope these people ( may be  yourself included) can  continue withoutfalling on old ways.

The thing here is to  separate very personal  experience from thecollective  experience and  the motivations of the CAI and it’sleader(s).

Especially if you’ve hada   massive deliverance from addiction,it’s extremely hard to be objective about CAI and Scott.

Scott is  truly an charismatic and inspirationalleader.

But he`s fundamentally flawed  - putting it nicely.

The other thing is,  CAI does not  have a  monopoly on deliverance  from drugs etc-  actually  many faiths and non-religious  organisations also  have success.

Other people  achieve deliverance /freedom  for apersonal experience – not necessarily religious.

..  to  thebenefit of the CAI,  it happens that somepeople come our way -  making  for great testimony.

I AM  not  belittling your own experience and wish you good health….  But it is not unique.

YOUR EXPERIENCE  IS GENIUNE  ..  although there may be  different ways to  understand how thisoccurred

It is true there are moments the fellowship can be good, even the music - theseare often things that keep people in CAI .
For me this  probably delayed mydeparture for a couple of  years –through the fellowship we invest in relationships in the CAI it`s hard to make a break or think independently.  We`re emotionally  committed to the CAI and our CAI friends.

I  too had  great  moments of fellowship and  loved the music  (though a little limited in style).

oddly looking  back - some (fairly) good memories ! 
 

Even after leaving,  I too  for a  long time was of the  opinion Scott`s  `just  a  misguided` but well intentioned  Leader.

It  didn`t occur to me Scott was  massively wrong,  nor even something more sinister.

…  I suspect I thought of him much  like how you think at the moment.

But, Scott is a wileyfox.....     he is a deceitful  hypocrite.

He  smiles and laughs a lot,  he is very good at connecting to  people.

He is believable.
He is  someone  you can  believe in.
but
... he is  unrepentant  and  decidedly  so.

...  he  is deceitful  and blatently   so  on  many levels (scriptural, financial, personal).

I  was in  awe of him when in the CAI.  

When in his presence,  everything seems to make  perfect sense.There`s  clarity  and conviction. 

He says  something though not necessarily  scripture,but  sure sounds fabulous and deep.

We  hang on every  sentence  he utters or writes. 

We will do  anything he asks. 

We are not  objective free thinkers in his presence.

He becomes our conscience !

But,  Scott isn`t a  mis-lead  agent of the Lord. 

Watch the  documentary…  there are some  very very  serious accusations  against  Scott from the most senior members of theCAI. (now ex-members)

The folks  in the documentary  were the inner circle of the CAI…  these aren`t  just  normal members in a small  back-waters cell group. 

Scott  hasn`t come to  court to  clear his name – rather  done his best to  avoid  court.    WHY ?! 

Scott and the  CAI

-         Are motivated bypower and money and possibly  particulartype of sexual  stimulus

-         This may be hardto  believe, but it`s true….  I could n`t believe this for a long time.

-         The CAI isabout  controlling all  aspects of member`s   lives, coercing believe to  accept   and obey `teaching`  

You are perfectly right,  Scott   `puts through the teaching` (his  teaching, with veryselective scriptures) 

LEST  WE FORGET … wasn`t  so much  a reference to  Scott`s teaching of WWI  WWII,  rather, least we forget  our  experiences of the CAI  (LEST WE FORGET  in the CAI ...  is all about  remembering the CAI teaching  `putting  through the teaching and the  will of the overseer`).

-         This documentary  is a timely reminder, things aren`t all rosy and wonderful at the CAI, but there rather a lot that stinks

-         There is a lot ofbad things

Members are 

-         Financially  stripped of their  savings   and forced to pay  heavy `offerings`  and fines

-         Almost allare  psychologically &  verbally bullied   

-         Sexual  abuse also occurred.

-         Some are  physically beaten

-         Forced to  take on huge /  onerous  tasks  

-         Forced to attendmeetings  (sometimes  summoned to other  countries)

-         Forced to movecountries and  give up their livelihoods

-         Separated fromfamilies  (inside and  outside of the CAI)

-         Alienated &discouraged to spend time with families  and friends

-         `admonished`   -  Threatenedfrequently

-         Financially  punished.  -  fines  / offerings

-         Monitored  

-         We are  sexually compromised -   how can a  leader of a anti-homosexual  church encourage  men sleeping together and  message nights.

-         Plus more…   

The  CAI is a genuine CULT  .

-         We fundamentally  do not  accept  salvation message as taught by mainstream

-        Do not  preach the holy trinity  (A51   or A53 for ref to  oneness church of God)

-         We have  lots of laws  (bible or otherwise)

-         We  have many unusual  teaching  - particularly the whole  British Isrealthing

-         Little  understanding about  atonement,  forgiveness, sin)

-         Very keen on  preaching hell-fire and  repentence

-         Separatist  - exclusive ….  Little fellowship  with other Christians

-         We  edit teaching material from  original  sources to make it  conform to  CAI teaching.

Viking1  if you re still in the CAI ,   I hopeyou`ll  be able to make your  way out.  It`s possible  but  can be hard.

The people in the documentaryare  genuine – they are  witness to many wrong things that occurredand were themselves victims of Scott.   

Please  take the  time when you can  and  watch again this documentary.
It`s been the best thing that`s happened for the CAI in a long time.

it may  take  much  thought and questioning  to  be able to  change your  point of reference.
 - some of the claims  may sound  `fantastic`   but  they are geniune   unfortunately

all the best !!  :-)

 anon1

 Dear Ian,

Thanks for your message. Interesting thoughts. I am not embracing all doctrins on "Truth for Free". However, since it did help me get out, it is natural and logical that I am very grateful for that effect at least.

One question back to you: Have you read "The Great Eccelsiastical Conspiracy"? You make several statements and claims with little backup/sources/references. The Greek word "ecclesia" did certainly not mean church as we know it... just to give one little example. Another interesting source on the matter is Torben Sondergaard (www.thelastreformation.com) and his video series (The Pioneer School) as well as his books. Not sure if our dialogue should continue in this forum though.

Blessings, TwikieB

One question back to you: Have you read "The Great Eccelsiastical Conspiracy"? I have not. My general reading time is limited, so I tend to devote myself more towards substantial works of non-fiction. You make several statements and claims with little backup/sources/references. This is hardly surprising given it wasn't my intention to write a literature review on the previously discussed material. My aim was much simpler, to voice caution about the newly separated Revivalist's tendency towards over-enthusiastically "swallowing" new "food" before learning how to "chew" and "taste" it first. The Greek word "ecclesia" did certainly not mean church as we know it... just to give one little example. Really? According to whom? Another interesting source on the matter is Torben Sondergaard (www.thelastreformation.com) and his video series (The Pioneer School) as well as his books. Interesting? Doubtless. Reliable? Doubtful. Mr Sondergaard seems to have as good a grasp of what Acts 2:38 teaches as did Lloyd Longfield and Scott Williams.

Not sure if our dialogue should continue in this forum though. It seems as good a place as any, given you've been promoting the material here.

Blessings,

Ian

 Hi All

if you are leaving (have left) the cult -  get professional counselling.

Covenants and doctrines, faith/convictions etc,  may be something you wish to follow, certainly I did this for several years after my departure from CAI.

I would like to point out - Christianity (what ever favour)  does not / may not have all the answers and may not be the final place you'll end up on the end out of CAI. Be aware of this possibility even if it seems an unlikely  path for you. For instance,  I  myself am now  healthily sceptical and  have little desire to commit my life 'to the Lord'

....DO get help - talk to a trained professional, this applies to those who did not suffer sexual abuse....  the psychological support will help ... and a proper counsellor will help you move at your own pace - it can be for some quite painful and difficult at first opening up.  Take care of yourself - you're  worth it :-)    

 an  un-biased , trained counsellor will help you   work through  your  past  experiences and deal with your  immediate future.

Please  seek  help

 - this does not mean you are compromising your  faith (asking for psychological help)

 Hi Ian & Flatearth,

Ian: Thanks for your comments above. I would like to answer briefly.

1. No need to look back, since I can't change the course of events. I had a very good journey out, based on starting to read The Word while several times "re-setting" my mind (with help of others).

2. We seem to have come to different conclusions regarding what "church" is, and I respect that. Regarding the word church: A use of the ISA (interlinear scripture analyzer) as well as understanding the context, it becomes fairly clear. David Yeubanks comes to the same conclusion in "Who Are the Clergy" as does the author of  "The Great Ecclesiastical Conspiracy".

3. I am also moving away from Torben's theology.

Flatearth: I may still have much CAI mentality in me, and see that as natural. I Think it is coming out of me step by step though. Yes, I was one of the "officers". I do find sources important though, as do most people who are open minded and investigative.

Blessings,TwikieB