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Didaktikon
Re :   Reply To Galien

I sense much fear in you young Padawan.

Only for you, Galien. Only for you.

Goose.

Ian



07/11/2009 05:24:48


Didaktikon
Re :   Reply To Fremde

Good evening, John.

I suppose what worked for me best, was to study the history of Christian teaching on these and related subjects. In doing so I soon discovered that the Christian Church had, by-and-large, believed in and taught from an "Old Earth Creationism" perspective; that Genesis chapters one and two weren't necessarily seen as "scientific explanations" for how God created, rather they simply affirmed theologically that God had created; et cetera. Learning the biblical languages, immersing myself in the range of contexts that impart sense and meaning from Scripture and similar sharpened my appreciation for understanding biblical teaching aright, which better enabled me to logically appreciate, adopt, and affirm what is a unified and internally consistent Christian world-view.

Everyone is different; I'm analytically minded so I tend to approach these tasks after such a fashion. I also read broadly and deeply, all the while attempting to keep abreast of the best of scholarship.

Blessings,

Ian



07/11/2009 05:10:16


Metanoian
Re :   Reply To outaegypt

I suppose the courts could ultimately seize the personal assets of both Victor and Simon ??   Which could well happen if both persons are clearly implicated by the facts and found guilty of involvement in the scandal.... lets wait and see how the umpire blows his whistle. 

M. 




07/11/2009 04:07:25


Galien
Re :   Noel is not the Lord's Annointed

Ian,


I find it ironic that you go on about "fallen human nature" and nastiness so frequently, yet should a comparison be made between you and me, you present as being a Jedi master with respect to such traits, whilst I am little more than a Padawan learner


I sense much fear in you young Padawan


07/11/2009 03:34:13


Fremde
Re :   Noel is not the Lord's Annointed

Ian,

You wrote: I find it ironic that you go on about "fallen human nature" and nastiness so frequently, yet should a comparison be made between you and me, you present as being a Jedi master with respect to such traits, whilst I am little more than a Padawan learner

May I add to that in my best Yoda?.....

"Fight she must not....Listen she must....learn she will.....
Striving causes anger.....anger brings Moddycanbootyou.....
Unpleasant it will be.....hmmm.....hmmm"
(Excerpt from "The Umpire Strikes Back")


John


07/11/2009 02:22:14


Fremde
Re :   Read this book!

Ian, thanks for the book recommendations.

From a young age I had a fascination with Palaeontology and I have a huge collection of simple through to scientific books on the subject. I had my sights set on being a Paleontologist. I had the IQ and the smarts but no dedication, so i dropped out of school at year 10, with my dream somewhere floating away.

Then came "Revivalism" and the dictates of "evilution" (spelling error deliberate). After being coerced into the PRC, Creation Science like a lot of things drew me in.

So where did I end up post-Revivalism? Fence sitting.

I have great difficulties with evolution because of the gaps in "missing links" and what I think are impossibilities of evolution like the hummingbird, the woodpecker etc with multi specialised peculiar characteristics, which, without each, the birds would not have been unable to function or survive in their habitat. These are not the only critters for which evolution doesn't seem workable, but they are prime examples.

On the other hand it is difficult to speculate that humans lived along side the Apatosaurus, Tyrannosaurus Rex (Rex because he believed in British Israel? heh heh heh), Rhamphoryncus and other gargantuan beasts. One can "prove" a worldwide flood, but with a great deal of difficulty! Too many gaps in the hypothesis, just like evolution.

Then we get to carbon dating which sort of works until you go back millions of years and a whole lot of speculations by biologists and paleontologists theorising get taken up as facts.

I did not raise my children as either Pentecostals or Christians (these were my Prodigal years). My son went to a Church of England Grammar School which was weak on encouraging or teaching faith and doctrine, so he declared himself sort of agnostic. During his university years we once had a discussion during which he declared that he had just as much trouble believing evolution as any religious belief and we both agreed on the similarities of fanaticism and blind faith in both. I have met many evolutionists, who, with a small "brain cell tweak" would make fervent Pentecostals.

I believe, as I have testified, that God in His grace, was merciful and I stopped "kicking against the pricks". The Holy Spirit has worked a change of mind and heart in me. One day my son asked me why I believed and I quoted, with passion, John 6:67 to 69 and Matthew 16:13 to 17. He went quiet.

Not wanting to get caught up in speculation of the Revivalism kind, things that puzzle me, I pray about and leave in God's hands. A bit like, once bitten, twice shy. Please do not interpret that as a closed mind.

Like the global warming debate, there are a lot of folk adhering to a tenet, without a clue of the detail. Is it because of Revivalism, that while I believe that deforestation, pollution and overfishing etc are ruining the planet, I cautious of rash judgement and poorly-planned decisions from people that I wouldn't send down the street to get me the newspaper?

How did you sort things out after the your numbing Revivalism experience?

John




07/11/2009 01:25:54


Didaktikon
Re :   Reply To spitchips

Hi, Chips.

Walton's book is an excellent entree into the subject of Genesis chapter one and the Creation/Science issue. In this respect  it's probably without parallel. The other work, however, is a commentary. Consequently, it's better at providing a sure guide through the entire book of Genesis; of placing the part within the framework of the whole.

Both are excellent resources.

Blessings,

Ian



06/11/2009 22:41:53


spitchips
Re :   Read this book!

Hi Ian

It seemed such a sign to me, I immediately ordered Dr Walton's book and will keep an eye open for the other one, too.

Never thought I'd be even interested enough to read up on these matters - wonders never cease.

I see the 'one most cool' has given a wee warning to our Gal.

Chips



06/11/2009 22:37:23


Didaktikon
Re :   Reply To spitchips

Chips,

If you're looking for a good, readable commentary that covers all of Genesis, then "Genesis: A Commentary" by Professor Bruce Waltke and Cathi Fredricks is as good as any and better than most. $44 from Koorong at the moment.

Blessings,

Ian



06/11/2009 22:09:51


Didaktikon
Re :   Reply To brolga

Hi, Ralph.

Leaving aside the standard commentaries, you could do worse than to purchase Dr Craig Koester's, "Revelation and the End of All Things" ($21 at Koorong). Koester's book functions as a guide to Revelation, outlining all the major interpretative positions, but with a clear focus towards the text and its purpose.

Blessings,

Ian


06/11/2009 21:22:13


brolga
Re :   Read this book!

Ian,

Amazon online is my only convenience to aquire books at the moment, as this book cost is very small amount for cost of shipping, I would like to order perhaps something on Revelation. Can you recommend something on Revelation to build the order? thanks.

Ralph

Fww, I have always had the notion; by having the correct knowledge and understanding of the first and last books of the bible, the in-between should fall into place much easier.?


06/11/2009 20:00:27


spitchips
Re :   Read this book!

Ian,

Over night I got thinking, I must Ian or others to recommend a book regarding a good interpretation on Genesis. Well, hello and thanks. Going on line to purchase today.

Thanks

Chips



06/11/2009 18:43:21


Didaktikon
Topic :   Read this book!

Good morning, all.

Genesis chapter one seems to be a perennial favourite among those who like to wrestle with matters hermeneutical. Unfortunately too many people hold to positions statements which aren't adequately informed by the facts. "The Lost World of Genesis One" by Dr John Walton will go a very long way to properly situating the interested reader with the interpretative options. Its about $20 from Koorong at the moment, and is an excellent read!

Highly recommended!

Ian


06/11/2009 18:19:25


Didaktikon
Re :   Noel is not the Lord's Annointed

Galien,

Have you gotten the message? Finally?

I find it ironic that you go on about "fallen human nature" and nastiness so frequently, yet should a comparison be made between you and me, you present as being a Jedi master with respect to such traits, whilst I am little more than a Padawan learner


In closing, the "writing is on the wall" with respect to your continued engagement here. Start listening, or be prepared to lose your "voice" altogether.

Hypocritical goose.

Ian



06/11/2009 17:40:37


Galien
Re :   Noel is not the Lord's Annointed

Yes thank you John, I got the message. I was just answering a post thanks.


06/11/2009 16:38:46


Fremde
Re :   Noel is not the Lord's Annointed

Galien,

Can't you read?

You are treading on thin ice. Uncoolman (who, in case you didn't know, is the "Bwanna" the "Grand Poobah" the "Head Honcho" the "Big Enchilada" the "Boss Cocky" of this forum) hasn't asked you to wrap it up, he has TOLD you.

Unless you want to get the boot, for the first time in your life (I opine) act like a tortoise and pull your head in. That means cease and desist from your nasty character assassinations and vitriol. Should we ask Wernher von Braun to explain it to you? It shouldn't have to be rocket science!

Thank you Moddy!

John


06/11/2009 15:55:57


Galien
Re :   Noel is not the Lord's Annointed

STE,

If I may be so bold as to voice my opinion, from the grandstands of this forum, this agora, this arena of sorts, then can I say that what we are watching is a "fight" between a seasoned revival-doctrine killer and an incredibly cocky upstart. Whilst it was kind of painfully amusing for a while, it is getting very tiresome, since you always make the same point over and over. How long are you going to be repeating it for? 

Does one need to be BOLD to voice an opinion?

One tends to fight against human nature, which is of course futile. Yet one feels that if one sits by and says nothing when nasty bits go on, that one is not doing one's "job" as a christian and a decent human being. One, having been the victim of a nasty cult cannot understand how its okay to be a christian teacher and willfully nasty at the same time. One spent nine years in revival watching identical behaviour, so one assumes that if the "real" truth has been found the behaviour would be different. One despairs that it is not.

One other thing doesn't make sense. If there is so much evil in group dynamics as you propose to see and experience, and if these groups tend to propagate such evil behaviours (as you claim to see in some here on the forum), then it would follow that such has been the case for thousands of years, with every type of organisation under the sun, including this forum. In that case, what makes you think that your excessive and constant hyperventilation here will do anything to change this? It will just wear you out. I would suggest either walking away, or finding it within yourself to discuss topics without  personalizing  everything, otherwise you will just hurt yourself. 

One was worn out with frustration years ago that people still like to hold on to illogical, hurtful ways of behaving even though they are christian. One has felt so full of despair one has wanted to lie down and die more than once because people are essentially dishonest, and can be so evil. However, one needs to live, and one must be true to oneself to do that instead of following the crowd. One just hopes against hope that those who love god will one day see that there are all kinds of evil in the world, not just the obvious stuff. 

I suppose in my reasoning, made when a child, is that if it is our nature that is sinful and displeasing to god, then putting on the mind of christ involves being opposite to human nature. Opposite to being petty, dishonest, self seeking, political, faithless, mean, seeking status in the recognition of others or for the material things we own, the belief or need to feel we are in any way better than others etc. Perhaps I have been wrong in this, but I am who I am now, and I still cannot really see how being any of the things I have mentiond can be pleasing to god.

I really like your posts STE. More. Please.




 


06/11/2009 15:09:30


Uncoolman
Re :   Noel is not the Lord's Annointed

Galien

Thus far, Ian has not invoiced me for the time he spends on my forum fielding questions I'm not qualified to answer, but I feel that pretty soon, he just might!

I honestly thought (and hoped) you'd give up by now. Gosh, even 'Luke' gave up at some point.

Last drinks please. Wrap it up.


06/11/2009 08:01:33


SintaxErro
Re :   Noel is not the Lord's Annointed

 Galien,

If I may be so bold as to voice my opinion, from the grandstands of this forum, this agora, this arena of sorts, then can I say that what we are watching is a "fight" between a seasoned revival-doctrine killer and an incredibly cocky upstart. Whilst it was kind of painfully amusing for a while, it is getting very tiresome, since you always make the same point over and over. How long are you going to be repeating it for? 

One other thing doesn't make sense. If there is so much evil in group dynamics as you propose to see and experience, and if these groups tend to propagate such evil behaviours (as you claim to see in some here on the forum), then it would follow that such has been the case for thousands of years, with every type of organisation under the sun, including this forum. In that case, what makes you think that your excessive and constant hyperventilation here will do anything to change this? It will just wear you out. I would suggest either walking away, or finding it within yourself to discuss topics without personalizing everything, otherwise you will just hurt yourself. 

That's all folks....
SinTaxError




06/11/2009 04:57:34


Didaktikon
Re :   Reply To Galien

Galien,

Ghandi said - even in a majority of one, the truth is still the truth.

Absolutely! But your problem is to assume that what you present is, indeed, the "truth". I've amply demonstrated that it isn't. Instead of being "fact" as you suppose, it's little more than "fiction", and not even "pious" fiction at that!

And as far as I know you don't have access to my private message box, and you have no idea how many people you annoy as much or more than you annoy me. They just don't bother arguing the point Ian because of the filthy way you speak to them.

Lucky me. Perhaps you could learn from their examples? That is, if you're capable of learning anything from anyone.

Goose.

Ian



06/11/2009 02:16:20

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