Reply To: Lost

Hi Lost before I go on I would just like to clarify that I myself have not been vocal or negative on the tongues subject to date, I have not cast any opinion on the issue so please feel free to peruse back over my posts & you will find no such negativity.

But rather I am listening & looking for the first time at other peoples opinions & findings in which within the revivalist way of thinking is certainly a NO NO.

I will not deny the fact that I spoken to all three parties concerned in this thread lightly on the subject, that were mentioned... H&S, Mr Jonah & Wazza

However my speaking to them & keeping in touch with these guys does not place me into the same kettle of fish, but I have made my intentions clear to Mr Jonah & H&S that I am prepared to listen for the first time & take a look outside the GRC & revivalism mindset, to consider the possibilities as to what if  the revivalist got it wrong.. They got it wrong with BI & follow a false doctrine there, so if  the revivalist that declare tongues is a necessity to bible salvation, that has been adapted as part of there doctrine is not 100% correct, it should be opened up for scruntiny.

Those that vehemently strive to defend it, won't & will not think outside of there square as it is the basis of separating them from the world & other Christians.

I may be ridiculed by some now for even considering the possibilities on tongues being a hyped up propaganda strategy to define a true Christian.

Have we, that attended the GRC & other revivalist networks been captivated by this one doctrine? I don't know, till date, I have opened up on the subject , to peruse over all the information now that is available to me & I can fear no such reprisals from anybody.

The one thing that has made me feel comfortable is that the scriptures once used to intimidate its revivalist members into fear that tongues is right cannot be applied to me no more.

The scripture Mark 3 vs 29

:but he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but he is in danger of eternal damnation.

This very scripture alone is used against warning people of the following dangers of speaking against tongues.

As pointed out to me ...What is considered blasphemy ? & also the scripture mentioned does not imply tongues but rather says the Holy Ghost, so therefore I have nothing to fear by acquiring the information on tongues if it is real, false or past time example or a gift to those who have received.

I believe now with the scriptures used with fear implied in them as it comes to light that they are being misinterpreted, that we can now look at other prospects of what was being said.

As things come to light a lot of findings are showing us that we are either being lied to & lead astray & that by believing in one mans rhetoric & way of thinking we can be so indoctrinated & believe another mans lie like so many of the revivalist still do.

Anyway I hope that gives you an understanding where I stand at present.

I'm sure Mr jonah, H&S & Wazza will reply shortly after me with there explanations where they stand.

Take care,    Robust

Reply to Lost:

I addressed this to all of you gentlemen because you have been very vocal in attacking the experience and discrediting it.

Hi and thanks for your questions. On my behalf, I'm sorry if I seem to have been attacking and discrediting the experience. There has been some immaturity on my part in some of my posts (eek). That's just me... I'm not gonna pretend to be wise and tactful haha. I think Mr J has been much more respectful and Wazza has been passionate... but I'm sure they'll speak for themselves.

1. After I repented, got baptized, I was in my room asking for the Holy Spirit. Yes, I did say hallelujah until I got tired and stop. But when I opened my mouth again, a clear language came out. No mumbo-jumbo. Just a clear language. Tell me, what did I receive? What was that? Was it conditioning of the mind?

In the good ol' Revival we were told we can't go wrong, during witnessing, if the least we do is tell our testimony. My testimony is similar to yours but I believe it was conditioning of my mind. I don't believe that any one form of the ever-changing dialects I ever vocalised could ever be defined as a language but rather a free flowing randomisation of sounds. Not that it was a bad thing to chant that way during prayer. I think the whole process is relaxing and meditatory. It's one of the gifts of the spirit. I'm pretty hopeless at all of the other eight...

2. What exactly do you believe now in how to be born again and be saved?

If I was to tell you what I truly believed here you would probably think... "oh no, giggle, no, it can't be that easy? God isn't quite that nice and forgiving. He wouldn't let any old rif-raf into the kingdom. Sorry, that may be judgemental of me but it's exactly the way I thought 18 months ago.

3. If speaking in tongues is not the sign of the infilling of the Holy spirit, then what is?

See table below: The conclusion is that there is no one sign of the baptism of the Holy Spirit. There are many different signs of the outpouring of the Spirit in the book of Acts.

4. When Jesus said in Acts 1 that you wait for the promise of the Holy spirit, and he mentions that you will receive the power after the Holy Ghost come upon you, what is this power? Is it not the experience of speaking in tongues.

Why, did it feel powerful? If it did then you can check that off your list of signs from the table below, I suppose. My wife and I and many others I speak to don't think it feels a heck of a lot like 'power'. Ever touched a live wire?.. there's power (and there's me being a bit cynical again). Unfortunately in my life as a christian I never personally felt any supernatural power but respect the testimonies of those that say they have. Perhaps the word 'power' needs to be defined.

5. Do you think that the tongue experience only refers to the time of the apostle and is not applicable for this generation?

It seems from an exaustive debate in another thread that the initial and miraculous experience of of the Spirit's outpouring (where tongues were understood in their own languages) was different to the use of the gift (where no man understands because you speak to God). I think it was a pertinent and important miracle to be used during the initial preaching of the gospel. It had to be networked quickly (I'm musing). I'm sure the miracle could happen today... as much as it is possible to walk on water... and oh how I've tried lol.

I'm a mess. I have so many questions but I cannot seem to remember them. Please answer as truthfully as you can. I've lost the best 10 years of my life not realizing that I'm following a man and not God. I don't want to commit that same mistake again.

What you will read here will be confusing. There's no head guy here with a list of beliefs we all conform to. Some of the posters are well educated, others not (me), some lie, some tell the truth, some think they tell the truth, some defend blindly what they have believed for so long... because otherwise... a lot of life seems such a waste and it turns the universe completely upside down. When we complicate things too much it's easier to throw it all away rather than pursue it. The simplicity of the gospel is so under-rated.

The 16 years I spent in ignorance can be well written off as a good learning experience. You are definitely not alone in your thoughts and struggles. It's a challenge.

Thank you so much.

Good luck - Pete.

Hi and welcome to "Ask the Blasphemers".  The show where we ask blapshemers to blaspheme so eveyone can know they're blasphemers and like to blaspheme. 

Ok, so on with the show...

Reply to : Lost [Anonymous]

1. After I repented, got baptized, I was in my room asking for the Holy Spirit. Yes, I did say hallelujah until I got tired and stop. But when I opened my mouth again, a clear language came out. No mumbo-jumbo. Just a clear language. Tell me, what did I receive? What was that? Was it conditioning of the mind?

I cannot answer that for you.  I cannot interpret your experience as: 1- It's your experience and not mine;  2- I wasn't even there when it happened;

But...judging from what  you said, I would have to say it was 'not mumbo-jumbo' and was a 'clear language'.  That's all I can deduce.

2. What exactly do you believe now in how to be born again and be saved?

I am not a Christian.  However, I believe the Bible makes it clear that the Holy Spirit effects the saving work of Jesus when one believes in Christ.  All other things are steps of obedience.

3. If speaking in tongues is not the sign of the infilling of the Holy spirit, then what is?

Again, I am not a Christian so I have no opinion.  But again, Biblically, you should be asking, is there a sign?  The Bible certainly talks about fruit.  Perhaps one could look for that?

4. When Jesus said in Acts 1 that you wait for the promise of the Holy spirit, and he mentions that you will receive the power after the Holy Ghost come upon you, what is this power? Is it not the experience of speaking in tongues.

When I was a Chrisitian I always saw this as an 'equpping for service...much like the HS would come upon Old Testament saints for works of service.  But now, hmm...  I don't anything think much about it at all.

5. Do you think that the tongue experience only refers to the time of the apostle and is not applicable for this generation?

According to the Bible there is no evidence to support that it was only for the time of the Apostles.  As a non-Xian, I suspect it is all fiction...both then and now.

Reply to : Lost [Anonymous]

Now I have some questions for you...

Have you ever or do you now have any form of relationship to the Pilnuts, whether it be family, ministerial, frienship, etc?

What is the current nature of that relationship?

Ta.

MrJ

Hmm, okay.... Hi again Lost... there was a great TV series with a similar name. I wonder if polar bears are part of your problem? I hope you find yourself - truly. Pride is usually the biggest problem of all.

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speaking in tongues is not the initial sign or manifestation of the infilling of the Holy spirit, then what is?

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If you believe Mark 16, it lists signs - plural.... has anyone ever received all these 'signs' all at once? That'd be a very busy time at the 'seeker's meeting behind the curtain. They will follow believers but I hope you don't feel too bad if you haven't experienced all of them if not any. Jesus didn't say "this sign shall follow them".

Just a hypothetical thought - If  I was forced to lend money to someone and trust them with my life I would do so if that person displayed 'Fruits' in their lives rather than tongues. God sees our hearts and those sort of people who show themselvs as honest respectful christians are the ones I would trust, admire and respect.

There's so much dishonesty in the world that it's hard to trust anyone though, don't you think? As Ned Flander's little boy once said, in the Simpsons,... "lies make baby Jesus cry".

2^nd reply to Lost

Hi Lost I was wondering if your queries have some how been summarised ?

Secondly, as some of those that have been so kind  to offer you some assistance & thoughts on this matter, would it be ok if I could ask you 2 questions?

1.)Were you involved with the one of the Australian revivalist assemblies if so which one?

2.)Where abouts are you currently residing  (eg Australia , Victoria, New South Wales, South Australia ect ect ,   I am from Sydney Australia, if you were wondering)

Ok Hope to here from you again!

does it really matter in the end if you do or dont....it doesnt say IF YOU DONT SPEAK IN TONGUES YOU ARE GOING TO HELL..

  it doesnt say it...

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1. I was part of GRC church under NHH. After that, I attended Vineyard, AOG and many others.2. I'm currently working overseas.

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Lost,

You seem to be ducking these two questions.  Perhaps if I ask again..?

1. What has been and now is your relationship with the Pilnuts?

2. What country are you in now?

Mr J

(PS- Pilnuts have denied knowing who you are and I have no reason to doubt them...truly.  But do you KNOW the Pilnuts?)

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the doctrine of repentance, baptism, receiving the Holy spirit with the evidence of speaking in tongues which I still hang on to. I wanted to hear the other side, the extreme side of the boat which I never dared look into because of fear that I might get carried away by strange doctrine.

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"the extreme side of the boat" - funny when someone calls it extreme and it doesnt involve ecstatic speech as part of the salvation doctrine. lol... The majority of the christian world would call the doctrine of the minority extremist groups such as UPs & Rev etc extreme. It'a all about perspective I suppose, and where you're at in the continuum of life. Everyone is on different journeys, many are convinced about all sorts of unbelievable stuff.

Ecstatic language speaking is not reserved for the christians, it seems, if you have a recent thread and researched different religions you'll find people doing the strangest stuff. The Indigo children have been using tongues for over 20 years now. I've spoken to people that fell over in a crowd at Benny Hinn crusades. This slaying in the spirit is professed by those who experience it to have been a spiritually powerful experience, but I believe is utter bunk and more mind manipulation. It's another extreme doctrine that is a pointless thing to do, but hey... if you're not hurting anyone... just watch how you land... those churches should have rubber floors.

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does it really matter in the end if you do or dont....it doesnt say IF YOU DONT SPEAK IN TONGUES YOU ARE GOING TO HELL.. it doesnt say it...

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Well... no, it doesn't say that. I suppose the Revivians believe that is where ya all is goin'  if you dont seek the spirit properly and glossalate all over the place. Hell would probably suck for the first 50 million years... surely after that they'd start to turn down the heat a little and serve lemonade.... even for a few minutes. Jesus is merciful - I suppose they'll get sick of hearing all the screaming after about 600 million years and shut the place down. Remember us blasphemers, will ya guys in the New Jerusalem eh... cut us some slack and sprinkle some ice cubes down every now and again.

Seriously though, it's nice just to go to sleep at night and not feel guilty about not saying 'night' to God in tongues for half an hour before bed. Especially those nights when you have a terrible sore throat and it hurts to speak. I'm sure God doesn't mind if we don't speak to Him vocally during those times.

Reply to LOST:

I hope you don't mind me butting in, but may I make a suggestion? Do yourself a favor and stop consulting  these guys, especially Mr. Jonah. You may be  heading  for a spiritual suicide if you keep at it. He admitted that he's not even a Christian. So why bother with his arguments when he himself does not believe in speaking in tongues.

I certainly am not stopping you from looking into the doctrine which you have adhered to all these years, but just a friendly caution, be careful who to ask. Acts 2:38 is frowned upon by virtually all the Christian churches these days, but it does not mean that it is not true anymore. It may be taught by the GRC but it is not authored by Hollins.

The Word never changes no matter how unpopular people make it to be. The Word does not adjust to suit man's whims, control and convenience. Faith-only is the accepted and more popular teaching and I'm glad to hear that you are not settling for  the easy Christianity espoused by so many contemporary churches. 

One thing for sure, your experience is genuine. God has proven Himself to you in a very personal way. That has not changed, and it never will. We change. God doesn't.

PS: Lest these guys suspect me to be a Warren, NO I am not. The Warrens don't need people to defend or speak for them. They are upholding the TRUTH, and ultimately, they will be upheld by the TRUTH.

Regards and I hope you don't mind my unsolicited advise.

Concerned Browser

Hi Lost.

Let me add that I myself am out of GRC for years now, and like you, have been to AOG, Vineyard and other Pentecostal churches. I too have tried to ignore the false teachings which are prevalent there, but I could not deny my experience as described in the Book of Acts.

I know of a number of folks who are no longer with GRC and have upheld the salvation doctrine, and their assemblies are thriving and on fire. They have gotten rid of spiritual control and abuses  but have not compromised the salvation doctrine. Just thought I'd mention this.

You are not alone in your experience.

Hang in there.

Concerned Browser

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They are upholding the TRUTH, and ultimately, they will be upheld by the TRUTH.

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Truth... Truth... Truth... Truth... Truth... Truth... Truth... Truth... Truth... Truth... Truth... Truth...

Hmmm... What is truth?

In our contemporary culture truth is subjective. Whatever I happen to believe is true for me, and whatever you choose to believe is true for you. In that way of thinking, if the only truth is your own beliefs, then you will never see a truth bigger than yourself or your particular church

Our contrary self deceptions are the very things from which we need to be liberated from. We certainly have the right to believe what we like but as soon as we start to seal the deal and close our minds we stop learning and growing properly... our growth becomes stunted and deformed. Instead of a glass that overflows we have a glass with a lid glued on. ummm, i'm out of analogies now.

Jesus told an analogy (parable) about two men. A tax collector and  a pharisee (super righteous religious professional of the day famous for keeping every detail of the law). The pharisee congratulated himself for being so holy and for tithing - Luke 18:9-14 "Thank God that I am not like other  people".

It is my thinking, after being part of Revival for so long, that Revivians have taken the role of the Pharisee because of their skewed way of interpreting salvation. They have taken the spirit freely given for all and perverted it by enforcing a sign... they seeketh a sign. They thank the Lord daily for not being like OTHER christians. They witness along the streets encountering arguments.. looking for faults... instead of living lives that reflect Jesus' gospel, they unabashadly take on the pharisee's ego.. the ego that Jesus scorned.

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One thing for sure, your experience is genuine. God has proven Himself to you in a very personal way.

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Careful what you label an absolute... the narrow mind closes rather quickly.

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Do yourself a favor and stop consulting these guys

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Yeah... because the best way to discuss such things is with people who only believe one side of the argument... come on! I would not like to see you run a courtroom. This is typical 'cult control' advice... close your eyes whenever you think you're in danger because if you can't see it, it can't hurt you. Open your eyes... it'll help you from falling into ditches.

Honest&Sincerely

Reply to this whole thread:

Before I comment on the above related notice by ( Pastor Wrongfield)

I would just like to say that I myself was honest in the replying to the concerned person who started of this thread by: LOST

It is here in this very forum that we all have the opportunity to cast our opinions & table our thoughts, & search for the TRUTH & demand honesty with out fear or favour.

There is a saying: SPEAK THE TRUTH & THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE!

Truth!  who has the truth?         

Jewish Gentile claims that the Warrens bear the TRUTH a member of the Philippine churches under Brett Warrens Ministry of course your going to say that when you are a member of their church & fly there flag.

I remember clearly & it is written here in this FORUM that Pilinut (Sabrina) has said that the PHILIPPINE ASSEMBLIES have adopted a policy of OPEN TRANSPARENCY.

BUT, It now seems that they will resort to deceitful tactics, invent stories & create a scenario of a concerned soul searching for truth to maybe some how coax Myself ,Mr Jonah, H&S & Wazza into some sort of catergory to display us as blasphemers & non believers leading people astray , each & everyone of us that was mentioned in this thread gave different accounts of where we stood on our positions.

The only reason why we were PUBLICLY sort out in this thread because all the above party of 4 Mr Jonah H&S & Wazza have voiced that they do not support the WARRENS & there revivalist church.

I am sickened by at which lengths revivalist will go to support there cause & the people they will try to quash in there endeavours to do so with those that oppose their position.  

We all use the Forum to our advantage as an opportunity to get our point across to express opinions share our stories & give accounts of maybe some form of abuse we have received while in a abusive & manipulative church.

I know Pilinut (Sabrina) has not publicly shown support for these 2 characters who are from the Philippines, but in way of suspicion I believe you know these people too well you have told me so yourself that Jewish Gentile is a member under Brett Warrens ministry.

1.)Why would he LIE to be an ex member who has been out for years to support LOST's posts.?

2.)Why does LOST say he is in Singapore when the ip address he was using was showing that he is in the Philippines. LOST are you a member too off the Philippine assemblies too?

3.)LOST what are your intentions by creating a thread based on lies?

4.) Pilinut do you have any further to add on dishonesty & deceit in which was displayed here, within the ranks of the Philippine assemblies?

Do you guys still claim to be transparent or do you resort to nasty tricks & deceitfulness to portray yourselves as the right alternative FLAGGING THE TRUTH?

How is what has been displayed here any different to the behaviour that the GRC & other revivalist resort too?

Over to you   LOST Jewish Gentile & Pilinut!

Robust

Robust_18@yahoo.com.au

Hey Wazza, the serial poster, hows it going?, is there a reward program I dont know about for serial posting or something? If so i want to collect frequent poster points too....I will have to think of some other topics to bring up....

I wonder if Lost & Jewish Gentile have forfieted there poster points for being decietful about their Identities. mmmmmm

Im sorry to keep at this but something is bothering me with this thread although there have been those caught out lying,

I still have a strong suspicion that LOST is indeed the daughter(Kate) of Pilinut (Sabrina)

1.)Firstly I would like to point out again that we know this person:Lost has lied in this thread about his/her location as to where they are from as there post were traced back to Filipino IP addresses

2.)Reason I come to this conclusion is that the story bears striking similarities with Kates life mixed with a bit of non fiction.

Lost say: 1. I was part of GRC church under NHH. After that, I attended Vineyard, AOG and many others.

               2. I'm currently working overseas.

3.)Kate also was originally afflilated with GRC under NHH with her parents.

4.)Kate also has attended Vineyard, AOG & many others churches since they broke away from the GRC.

Lost says:I've accepted the GRC doctrine without question, I saw it in the bible, changed my life and that's it, I've hang onto it with my dear life. *Probably I'm a simpleton*, I can accept that but to be delusional or believing something that in the end is just a conditioning of the mind is not acceptable. That's why I need to know.

5.)Kate has very good reason to defend her Father & Mothers position as they too fully acknowledge & still hold dear to them the very fundamental aspects of the GRC salvation doctrine without question.

6.)while casting doubt & asking for our assistance in this thread on our position on tongues, she still declares that it could not be acceptable for one to believe that it could be a conditioning of the mind, So, she is answering her own doubt with her own answers.

So in turn it was a posed question in order to support an argument that has been continually debated by the Pilinuts through-out this forum over recent months.

7.) And finally the phrase: *Probably I'm a simpleton*   since the post was made from the Philippines I doubt very much a Filipino would know what a * simpleton* was but is rather is a word used amongst western nations & you will not find the word

*simpleton* within the Filipino language thus supporting my claim it is Kate or another member of the family who is a westerner.

8.)I know Pilinut has denied any family involvement with the *LOST's posts but either way if they deny it there is still something fishy going on with the involvement & the intentions of this thread.

Thanks Again Robust

Robust_18@yahoo.com.au

Here's my take on the situation...

Yes, it looks bad for the former Philippine GRC aligned churches.

However, it is possible that the Pilnuts were not party to the goings on of other P'Pino church members.  So while it stinks of deception, it is entirely possible that the Pillnuts are innocent.  Please keep that in mind.   Inspite of circumstantial evidence, they are still innocent until proven guilty.  And I suspect we will never prove anything.

LOST is a liar.  Plain and simple.  She (why do I get feeling it's a girl?) claims to be from Singapore, but her ISP is P'pino.  I lived in Singapore and KNOW that they do not reroute anything through the P'pines.  So she is a dirty rotten scoundrel and was up to God knows what.  She cannot be trusted.

Concerned Browser/Jewish Gentile perhaps should have identified his/herself as a member of the P'pine church but did not.  While this may be decepetive, it still is perhaps just an ignorance on his/her part and ,while may be seen as wrong, could be interpreted as unethical and not more than that.  But using numerous IDs is a bit too much.  I suggest that all people who post should be consistent in their ID at least.

Either way, well done P'pine church.  Any credibility you may have once possessed is out the window.  Perhaps this is alesson for you guys about the real world.  It's not a cult out here and you cannot hide for long or seek to control information.  Get a grip and know trhat you are just people...and from what we have seen...LIARS AT BEST.  What would Jesus do?  I suspect he would not be pleased.

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Hey Wazza,the serial poster, hows it going?, is there a reward programI dont know about for serial posting or something? If so i want to collect frequent poster points too....I will have to think of some other topics to bring up....I wonder if Lost & Jewish Gentile have forfieted there poster points forbeing decietfulabout their Identities. mmmmmm

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yea, going good man, work's flat chat!

As i dont have the net up and running at my new place i just logg on at different Internet cafe's.

Reply to: Pilinut

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Why are you providing a number of possible scenarios as to how Lost's post got here.

Pilinut don't you get it?

Lost states she/he has been reading this forum for some time & has stated that she/he has edited there post, as to say, They are a user on the forum, hence they say they started this thread.

Now! why would Lost who claimed to be in Singapore, re-route a post that she/he wanted answered from something they read on the forum & ask a local in the Philippines to enter the post on a computer there.

It is clear and simple the MODERATOR has stated that he checked & rechecked that the post made were in fact made from the Philippines.

No post were sent from Singapore Pilinut! The user Lost has stated they read the forum & have been for some time & it is indicated that Lost started this thread & implying to editing it.

So Lost has already been proven to be a LIAR by posting from the Philippines.

As for Jewish Gentile using a anonymous identity, no it is not a sin, but as for your reply Pilinut: "So what!" If you guys within the Filipina assemblies claim to be so transparent & have nothing to hide & are not ashamed to bear the truth, why hide behind anonymity "Jewish Gentile". Member of the Filipina assemblies.

We have not heard from Lost since........

Now Pilinut read Lost post's again & tell me if you still think they are from Singapore & that they may have got a local in the Philippines to post there little exercise on the forum.

As you claim to have no involvement in this thread I can not understand, & maybe you can help me with this one as to why you are providing possible scenarios as to how & why Lost's post got here & defending Jewish Gentiles position.

Still going to provide some more possible scenarios or have you had enough digging or do you want a bigger shovel....

Robust

Pilinut  Pilinut  Pilinut !!!

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Ducking & avoiding.... Your so, like a politician, but now you are saying a likely scenario is Lost flew over for a hundred for a $100 & posted in the Philippines by maybe some how using a relatives Internet caf?  Man where does it stop with the excuses.

Lost started this thread!  I know it! I'm sure everyone else knows it !  I think deep down you know it & I'm pretty sure Lost knows it!

Now you say that I have asked you to post on behalf of me, that is a lie, I have been capable of posting my own posts since day one & have not asked you to post on my behalf.

However I have ask you to attach pictures & links relating to the (Brydon golf & Sally Addison modeling issues & that is all.)

I'm sure people who read the forum & like Lost has stated for some time I think she/he is apt enough to post her/his message to this forum.

Now you say you don't have a beef with the Moderator checking ip addresses but you think that people within the GRC ranks would be concerned about this, they have nothing to fear as it is just an ip address that states if they are using a computer perhaps within the same country, household, library or I-caf?

But if they chose to use a different alias within that ip address it would still be clearly identifiable that it is the same user. Why should this be scrutinised when keeping this forum running is based on keeping people honest & posting with integrity.

Now Jewish Gentile has said she/he does not speak for the Warrens, perhaps she/he might want to explain why she/he posted as Concerned Browser & not Jewish Gentile.

And again I ask where is Lost now?  perhaps she/he can explain themselves instead of letting you do all the ducking & guessing as to why & how the post was started?

Robust

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PilinutPilinutPilinut !!!?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" />

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For those who came in late... Hi!

This thread started off well and there was some interesting stuff to chew over... in the first half dozen posts or so... then it pretty much went to crap... and has been spiralling ever since. I don't care who Lost is or was... I thought the questions asked were good - no matter who posted them.

Let it die rob please! Gee, it's getting scary in here! I can't see anyone admitting to anything and it seems to reek of paranoia. All in all, it's been thoroughly entertaining though. Thanks to all involved! Especially the FANTASTIC FOUR!!!!!