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bindi
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Rank:Regular Poster

Score: 3270
Registered: 10/09/2006

(Date Posted:18/06/2007 07:52:47)

Having just read a theory on alien abductions and studying the workings of the mind and how powerful it can be has led me to ask the questions...


(Message edited by Uncoolman On 31/05/2008 07:29:08)

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" IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING."
Allyson Jones

bindi
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Rank:Regular Poster

Score:3270
Registered: 10/09/2006


(Date Posted:18/06/2007 07:52:49)

Having just read a theory on alien abductions and studying the workings of the mind and how powerful it can be has led me to ask the questions... What indeed is 'real' and what is 'all in the mind.'

I'd really appreciate it if people could comment here about what they have experienced with God honestly and what it was that has them absolutely convinced beyond ANY shadow of doubt that it was from God and not something that perhaps the mind itself has conjoured up. Did you want the Holy Spirit SO bad and feared 'going to hell' so much that knowing without it, that is where you were destined to end up? Were you afraid you might not 'get' it? Have you ever, in quiet moments of thought, wondered if you DID actually receive it? Wondered if perhaps your mind had you convinced you had it?  I'm particularly interested to hear about any of you who actually 'spoke in tongues' without even being 'preached' too or knowing anything whatsoever about it.

After reading all this about alien abductions..... will it cause you to re-think your beliefs? Or is that a 'too scary to even contemplate' question?. Lets face it. We are/or have been too scared from walking away from what we have been taught to believe. Scared to even contemplate that there might be another way. The more we open our eyes, the more we learn.

To those that open up honestly about God and their beliefs, I sincerely hope that your openess will not be ridiculed by others but that you might be open to others thoughts on the idea. Once again, without ridicule.

As far as alien abductions are concerned, I am very interested in the questions these tales raise about human nature and the distinction between sensationalism and science. What do we know about people who claim to be abducted by aliens? What standards or rules do we apply to sort out truth from fiction and decide whether we believe the 'kidnap victims'?

Many psychologists ( not me yet! ) have studied the reported 'alien kidnappings', and one of the conclusions is that the kidnappings never occurred. However, the people making the claims are not necessarily mentally ill, nor are they lying.. These are by and large people who have 'remembered' their 'experiences' while undergoing therapy, and often under hypnosis. Tales of alien abduction are widely known throughout our culture, so it is not at all suprising that the 'memories' of 'kidnap victims' would tend to coincide. 'Abductees' generally claim that they are awakened during their sleep by the aliens and are unable to move. We know that many of our voluntary muscles-the ones that involve movement- become 'paralyzed' when we sleep, which is why we usually don't thrash around when we dream. 'Hallucinations' - that is, seeing and hearing things that are not really there - are quite common as we are waking from a sleep-paralyzed state - ( I can't tell you the amount of times Ive sat bolt-upright in bed with my eyes wide open fighting of hundreds of spiders that are hanging around my face! lol! ) - and it seems the reported experiences of 'abductees' fit the pattern. People are quite open to suggestion, especially during hypnosis. Memories are not perfect snapshots. "UFO" memories may be constructed from bits and pieces of sleep-related hallucinations, nightmares and media attention fixed solidly into place with the suggestion of hypnosis and the validation of support groups. I guess the same could be said for those of us who have had various 'experiences' with God. Our conviction is further validated by those around us who have 'experienced' the same. Dare I suggest, brainwashing??

Whats your thoughts?

Bindi

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" IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING."
Allyson Jones
prezy
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2#



Rank:Member II

Score:1240
Registered: 06/02/2007


(Date Posted:18/06/2007 11:13:30)

Reply to : bindi
Having just read a theory on alien abductions and studying the workings of the mind and how powerful it can be has led me to ask the questions... What indeed is 'real' and what is 'all in the mind.'I'd really appreciate it if people could comment here about what they have experienced with God honestly and what it was that has them absolutely convinced beyond ANY shadow of doubt that it was from God and not something that perhaps the mind itself has conjoured up. Did you want the Holy Spirit SO bad and feared 'going to hell' so much that knowing without it, that iswhere you were destined to end up? Were you afraid you might not 'get' it?Have you ever, in quiet moments of thought, wondered if you DID actually receive it?Wondered ifperhaps your mind had you convinced you had it? I'm particularly interested to hear about any of you wh
Hi bindi, I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God that may well have been chance or coincidence. However our son was born with a severe disability that included blindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help. My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see. I no of other similar things happening occaisionaly in other churches. I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault. I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and certainly not because you follow Noel Hollins version of being saved. 
dogmafree
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Rank:Poster Venti II

Score:7240
Registered: 21/02/2006


(Date Posted:18/06/2007 17:01:45)

Almost all of the 'experiences' that are attributed to God are pretty much as you say..........

Very real in the mind of the person who has the experience, but can easily be invalidated when subjected to rational scrutiny. But most people are too polite and never do challenge them. It's easier to just nod and allow the person to keep believing in their fantasies!

Dog.

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"for there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 2, Scene 2)
bindi
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4#



Rank:Regular Poster

Score:3270
Registered: 10/09/2006


(Date Posted:18/06/2007 17:36:42)

Reply to : prezy
Hi bindi, I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God that may well have been chance or coincidence. However our son was born with a severe disability that included blindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help. My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see. I no of other similar things happening occaisionaly in other churches. I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault. I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and certainly not because you follow Noel Hollins version of being saved. 

Hi Prezy

Thanks for your reply.

I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God that may well have been chance or coincidence. 

Yes... the same I think can be said for all of our affiliated churches. I don't know if you recall or read any of the posts in another thread.. either the Kevin Quirk topic or the Describe Your Perfect Church topic, but a few spoke honestly about healings and miracles in general. And it was discussed how much was 'put down to God' and like you mentioned here..how much was really down to just 'us' doing something about changing our situations or whether its coincidence. After all, it rains on the just and the unjust eh? It makes me wonder about all the 'miracles' that happen for people who have no 'religious' background or belief in a higher power as such. As my topic suggests, could the power of our mind heal us? Could the power of our own minds in fact deceive us as well?

However our son was born with a severe disability that included blindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help. My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see.

Wow! thats a pretty incredible miracle what happened to your son! Wonderful! Thanks for sharing it. How old was your son when he got his sight back? What did the doctors say afterwards? Did they do any scans on his brain again to see what had happened? Was your son old enough by that stage to have a 'faith' of his own? Please don't misunderstand me. My intention here is not to 'grill' you or discredit this healing. I'm just very interested to know. In my 14 years at the RF. I can't really recall any real big miracle healing that happened that couldn't be explained another way. I had a few 'healings' myself of minor things. But my curious mind now has me wondering if I, in fact, psyched myself into being healed. I am geniunely interested in hearing in detail REAL miracles. ( I don't know whether studying psychology is a good thing or a bad thing for me at the mo! LOL! Has me more confused about whats 'real' and what isn't! )

I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault.

Yes... well said. I think we all suffered terribley with condemnation if we didn't get 'healed' or 'blessed' in some way. Made to feel like we didn't have enough faith or something was 'wrong' with our walk. It, in our church anyway, was never 'said' in that way. But thats how you felt. 

I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and certainly not because you follow Noel Hollins version of being saved. 

Hmmm... I beg to differ there as doesn't the bible say that " By his stripes we WERE healed." ...Not... "By His stripes you MIGHT get healed. And  " Healing is the childrens bread" etc etc? Aren't Christians encouraged to believe that it is in fact the God given 'right' of Christians to be blessed and healed?

I recall a conversation with a fellow ex RF who's child had been stabbed. They were later contacted by another member of the RF and told.. " If you were in fellowship, this wouldn't of happened." I had to laugh at this as, ( and in fact, convince the poor parent that it was NOT because they had 'fallen away' that this happened! ) because if indeed they WERE still in the fellowship and this incident had occurred, the answer would of been different! The old.. " Ohh, its just a trial of your faith"!  Wasn't very 'christian' like encouragement for the poor parent I'm sure you would agree!

Anyway.. thanks again prezy. Would love to hear more in detail about your sons healing!!!

Regards.... Bindi

--------------------------------------------------------------
" IF I COULD WISH FOR MY LIFE TO BE PERFECT, IT WOULD BE TEMPTING BUT I WOULD HAVE TO DECLINE, FOR LIFE WOULD NO LONGER TEACH ME ANYTHING."
Allyson Jones
prezy
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5#



Rank:Member II

Score:1240
Registered: 06/02/2007


(Date Posted:19/06/2007 12:14:44)

Reply to : bindi
Reply to : prezyHi bindi, I believe there was an element of people believing what they wanted to believe at grc when we were there and probably exagerated abit at times our selves or at least put things down as the work of God thatmay well have been chance or coincidence. However our son was born with a severe disability that includedblindness caused by his brain and eyes not being connected. The doctors could of coarse offer nothing to help.My son was anointed with oil and prayed for. Next day he could see. I no of other similar things happening occaisionaly in other churches. I think that what we had issue with was when healings dont occur it is somehow the persons own fault. I believe you will only be granted that which you ask for if it be God,s will, not your right and expectation as a christian and

Hi Bindi,

              My son was about 9 months old if my memory serves me correctly when he gained his sight. We took him back to his neuroligist who was amazed, waved her hands up and said I dont know what youve done but it worked. He is now almost 5 and has some physical and intellectual disability but is going to kinder and walking and has some speech. Probably doesnt have much faith in God but did say amen once after we were praying.lol. Thanks for your interest.
MothandRust
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