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D-T-M
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101#
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Rank:Rookier II
Score:1830
Posts:75
Registered:28/08/2006
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RE:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:01/02/2009 17:31:26)
Disciple wrote:
Just a quick question. Can this fraudster face a jail term for all this ??
You can bet that ASIC will have him in the gun and he will be prosecuted.
Whether he is convicted will depend on the evidence that ASIC can produce for the Court.
If convicted he will face a custodial sentence which may not be as long as you think he deserves!
Mole
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Didaktikon
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102#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31540
Posts:1514
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To outaegypt
(Date Posted:01/02/2009 18:46:20)
Well,
I've just read Mr Duker's 'Notification of Bankruptcy--Debtors Petition', and was somewhat dismayed to note that his automatic discharge from bankruptcy date is set at 23 January 2012! Given the extent of the debts owed to creditors contained therein (including a debt of $2,000,000 owed to 'Duker Investments'), I doubt that he will be able to make good on his promise to repay in full (so well done, Simon). Finally, of the $34,287,411 ('yes', you read that correctly) that he owes, there doesn't seem to be any RCI pastors listed among the claimants. Is anyone surprised by this?
Very, very sad.
Ian
--------------------------------------------------------------
Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Disciple(Ex-member)
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Reply To Didaktikon
(Date Posted:01/02/2009 20:03:45)
Reply to Didaktikon (01/02/2009 18:46:20)
and was somewhat dismayed to note that his automatic discharge from bankruptcy date is set at 23 January 2012!
Ian
Bankruptcies normally last for three years but can be extended for 5 years on objection by the trustees ( and 8 years if he leaves Australia and fails to return) .. However bankruptcies remain on Veda Advantage credit files for seven years and although he may get ultimately discharged from his bankruptcy, never the less the ITSA bankruptcy record will always be available through the courts etc. The VA file will stop him obtaining any credit from banks etc for seven years but I think if he tries to obtain any credit while an undischarged bankrupt without disclosing it, he could face a conviction and possible jail sentence..
sad so many have been hurt while Simon Longfield and his sidemen did nothing about it all.
Still what happens now with the ASIC ? will he still have a case to answer ??
blessings
Eric http://www.itsa.gov.au/dir228/itsaweb.nsf/docindex/bankruptcy-%3Ebankruptcy+-+long+version?opendocument
(Message edited by Disciple On 01/02/2009 22:30:38)
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Im_out
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104#
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Registered:02/01/2009
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Reply To Didaktikon
(Date Posted:02/02/2009 14:26:57)
Reply to Didaktikon (01/02/2009 18:46:20)
Well,
I've just read Mr Duker's 'Notification of Bankruptcy--Debtors Petition', and was somewhat dismayed to note that his automatic discharge from bankruptcy date is set at 23 January 2012! Given the extent of the debts owed to creditors contained therein (including a debt of $2,000,000 owed to 'Duker Investments'), I doubt that he will be able to make good on his promise to repay in full (so well done, Simon). Finally, of the $34,287,411 ('yes', you read that correctly) that he owes, there doesn't seem to be any RCI pastors listed among the claimants. Is anyone surprised by this?
Very, very sad.
Ian
Hi Ian, is there a chance you could get an actual copy of this letter up here, like the news paper was put up?? A lot of folk I know who are still caught up in the organisation will still class this as "hearsay", and as you know the whole thing is being controlled, covered up, swept under the carpet and made light of. The folk I know need actual documentation, as this will cut through all this. Thanks Im out
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Disciple(Ex-member)
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Reply To outaegypt
(Date Posted:02/02/2009 15:54:26)
Reply to outaegypt (26/01/2009 00:19:42)
(Date Posted:25/01/2009 18:25:37)
blessings
Eric
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(Message edited by Disciple On 02/02/2009 15:59:24)
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Fremde
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106#
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Rank:Regular Member
Score:4470
Posts:219
Registered:19/09/2007
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:02/02/2009 17:17:03)
Let me start by saying that I have been blessed financially beyond measure. Nevertheless I have been dudded over many years by, trusted companions in fellowship, a friend of almost 20 years, a business associate I had assisted many times and a very large Australian charity that set up a very clever scam. The lot would total to well over $ 500,000.00.
Two of the above I walked away from and let my God and Father deal with. I blessed and didn't curse.
A pastor dudded me wages/commission in 1976 for over $ 2,500.00. In those days it was about a half a years wages. My pastor (so-called) knew, why didn't he assist? Why didn't I see it a symptomatic of the whole group? I was a dill. The "friend" of almost 20 years, robbed of over $ 200,000.00 me when I was acutely ill in hospital and recuperating for months. I asked him some time later why he did it and his reply was that I had made it too easy. To this day he has never apologised or offered restitution. Four months after leaving my employ he was sacked from his next company for going down the same path. Why didn't I see the signs, which were obvious in retrospect? Too trusting. I loved the guy. We went back a long way as mates. my wife didn't castigate me. She was as shocked as I. Nevertheless the buck does stop with me.
The business associate mentioned above, fleeced me for $ 12,000 and another business owner for about $ 25,000. He took him to court. It was an open and shut case of trading while insolvent. The other business owner asked me to testify in his action against the perpetrator. I did and despite his protest I refused any payment for my time. Despite my testimony was lauded by the barrister and the magistrate, the case dragged on. Finally the other aggrieved party was advised by the magistrate to try and settle out of court because the action was becoming long and costly. He settled and ended up with legal charges being further down the financial drain. naturally I did not pursue my case.
The large charity I mentioned above screwed me for $ 130,000.00 (and combined others for three times that amount) . The scam offshoot they had set up went bust. The Administrator appointed ended up being deregistered for dodgy dealing and the rats fled the sunk ship. The charity was big time implicated. The new Administrator was very helpful to me and other parties involved, but unless we were willing to throw a large lump more of money into trying to wring droplets out of a huge sponge, we were, as they say "up the creek".
A few months later I attended a symposium and ASIC had set up an information booth. I had a chat with a very helpful man and asked him how and why these sort of things go on without, it seems, anyone brought to justice and assets seized etc. His frank answer? ASIC has too many cases, limited resources, limited funding and insufficient personnel.
One guy who have dudded me had the audacity a few years on to request that I help him expunge the record of his dealings because he was having difficulty getting credit!
Sorry for the cynicism. But don't hold your breath waiting for "justice". I keep focussed on my blessing far outweighing misfortune. However I realise that a lot of people are hurting bad.
But life must go on. Jesus said that life does not consist of the abundance of things we possess. (Luke 12:15)
King David said: "I had fainted, unless I had believed to see the goodness of the Lord in the land of the living" (Psalm 27:13). Seeing is not believing. Believing is seeing. Hard to do carnally. Hard to do when all seems lost. Twenty-two years ago I was at rock bottom. A failure at life, spiritually bereft, I thought. Within a year I was blessed with a thriving business. My God and Father now strengthens me from day to day. Do I slide back? Does Satan throw darts of doubt? You bet. But where shall I go, Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God (john 6:69). Did he not say that in the world we will have tribulation? But be of good cheer! He has overcome the world! (John 12:33)
John
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Didaktikon
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107#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31540
Posts:1514
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To Fremde
(Date Posted:02/02/2009 18:21:50)
John,
Given your candid admissions as to the frequency with which you've been 'dudded', I can only assume that you're not a particularly 'astute' businessman (or at the very least, not a particularly careful one).
Ian
(Message edited by Didaktikon On 02/02/2009 18:27:43)
--------------------------------------------------------------
Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Fremde
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108#
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Rank:Regular Member
Score:4470
Posts:219
Registered:19/09/2007
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:02/02/2009 21:41:22)
Ian, what do they say about "assume"? It makes an ass of u and me.
As to being dudded by so-called Christians, saying I was not astute or careful would be an understatement! Being spiritually dudded hurt more. Life's a big learning curve.
As to business, my bad debts, in just over 20 years trading of approximately $ 100,000,000.00, I've lost say $ 500,000.00 thats 0.5 per cent. Is that careless, not astute? The year before the charity cheated me I made over a million dollars profit. I really think I can't complain. We do all the credit checks to the umpteenth degree but credit checks and references don't really amount to a hill of beans. There is always a risk. It's called "business venture". Look up what "venture" means in an Oxford dictionary, mine has "risky" followed by "enterprise" definitions. Heh heh heh. That's accurate!
I actually care less and trust God more these days. A scripture keeps coming to mind many days I go to work, or a problem looms "In Him, we live and move and have our being" (Acts 17:28)
Better still "For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?" (Matthew 16:26)
James Packer recently lost a few Billion, but in the scheme of how many Billions he has, how much is he affected or effected? What I have traded in twenty years, would seem huge to many, and loose change to James Packer. To our eternal Father, all flesh is as grass. (Isaiah 40:6)
Walk a mile in my shoes......
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spitchips
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109#
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Rank:Rookier
Score:1700
Posts:82
Registered:24/10/2008
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:02/02/2009 21:58:34)
Hi Fremde
Better still "For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?" (Matthew 16:26)
Absabloominlutely!!
I must say - those who are forced to rely on the legal system to get justice might be a long time waiting.
Working alongside lawyers has left me with little confidence that the truth will always be told, that those in the right will be vindicated or that monies are ever fully repaid. Who was it said 'The law is an ass'? - from Oliver Twist I think.
That's not to say we should not strive for justice, especially in light of the huge financial losses in the Duker fiasco, for example. The fight is all the more justified if we fight on behalf of those who don't have the means to fight or who have lost heart themselves.
But, as we fight, we shouldn't lose sight of our treasure already found, our peace already bought, our eventual salvation assured.
Waxing lyrical
Chips
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Episkopeo
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110#
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Rank:Regular Rookier
Score:5700
Posts:267
Registered:30/08/2007
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:02/02/2009 22:32:19)
Hi Fremde,
To bless and not to curse is good.
To allow your business associate and friend of 20 years to ROB you of $200,000 and to accept his explanation of "you made it too easy" and to "never apologise or offer restitution" doesn't do your friend, yourself or anyone else any favour. Unchecked, he did the same again, just 4 months later and was sacked from his next company of employment, and again doing the same to you and another business associate.
God Bless you Fremde. So pleased your once spiritually bereft life is now so successful.
Epi
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outaegypt
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111#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:03/02/2009 04:49:03)
Thanks John, your honesty is appreciated and encouraging. Being deceived has little to do with intellect, especially when it's from a position of trust. Chippy said The fight is all the more justified if we fight on behalf of those who don't have the means to fight or who have lost heart themselves. (I like your waxing Lyrical!)
For this very reason some of the ATO Credit debts have been cleared for 3 people so far in the RVP Liquidation, and for others who thought they were alone and confused they are now supported and seeing they are part of a much bigger picture, it may not change their financial situations immediately but emotionally it's huge and it gives hope.
The more awareness to the latest Liquidation the better, hopefully more people will come forward- He may have declared $34 Million but you can bet like we heard in the last Liquidation (RVP) there are more people that have no idea he is Liquidating- thats apparently what happened the last time, more creditors came forward having no idea RVP was Liquidating them joined forces took control of the Liquidation. I hope the same happens again.
(Message edited by outaegypt On 12/03/2009 22:06:54)
--------------------------------------------------------------
As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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Im_out
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112#
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Registered:02/01/2009
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:07/02/2009 07:49:23)
Heres the artical and here is the web link for those that need it. Sundays Melbourne Age http://www.theage.com.au/national/bankrupt-former-pastor-may-owe-creditors-40m-20090207-80ge.html?page=-1Bankrupt former pastor may owe creditors $40m<!-- Insert Article Content --><!-- Article Details --> - Michael Bachelard
- February 8, 2009
A FORMER fundamentalist church pastor who lost millions of dollars in investors' money through questionable property deals has become one of Australia's biggest bankrupts, going to the wall owing a massive $34 million. But the real figure owed by Melbourne churchman and lawyer Glenn Duker could be even higher, up to about $40 million, because other debts that he personally guaranteed do not appear on his bankruptcy notification. Insolvency experts say this probably puts Mr Duker among the 10 biggest bankrupts in Australia in the past decade. Mr Duker, a former pastor with Melbourne-based Revival Centres International, threw in the financial towel on January 9 after seven years of living a rich life while losing millions of dollars of other people's money. His church, Melbourne-based Revival Centres International, however, stands by him. Its deputy leader, Vic Semoilenko, told the flock in December that it was "sad that people (complaining about Mr Duker) could be so bitter, and it was sad that people could make so many errors and then want to blame others for their errors". Mr Duker has listed his largest creditor as the National Australia Bank's low-doc loan company, Homeloans Ltd, which is said to be owed $12 million (though Homeloans Ltd disputes that it would have this exposure). Other commercial lenders are owed more than $1 million each. Mr Duker also owes his mother $1.4 million, and his family's investment company $2 million. Many of the bad debts were accrued after the Australian Securities and Investments Commission abandoned action against Mr Duker and his former property development company, RVP Group, in 2007. ASIC accepted Mr Duker's promises to repay money owing to investors. Some did receive their money back, but others were left short, and only those who threatened legal action were repaid. One Victorian victim said she was forced to sell everything after Mr Duker reneged on a personal guarantee of $150,000. RVP Group, like most of Mr Duker's other companies, is now in liquidation, and the liquidator believes it traded while insolvent for much of its life. Other companies are under the control of his wife, Lorilea. It is now clear, however, that, as an individual, Mr Duker continued borrowing and spending other people's money on property throughout 2007. Former Sydney Swans player Craig O'Brien sold a $1.3 million Surfers' Paradise home to Mr Duker in mid-2007, but agreed to lend part of the sale price back to him, as long as it was repaid with interest. Mr Duker quickly tried to offload the house, then the bank eventually sold it at a loss to recoup their loan to Mr Duker, and Mr O'Brien saw no return. He claims he is owed about $700,000. Mr Duker foreshadowed his bankruptcy to Mr O'Brien a year ago in a text message that also said, "Sorry for your loss." Mr O'Brien said the Dukers were living last year in a Brighton house, "paying huge rents, sending their kids to expensive private schools and both of them were driving brand new BMWs". Asked for comment on the bankruptcy, Lorilea Duker told The Sunday Age: "I really don't have time at the moment and I'm really not interested." Mr Duker began his investment business in 2002 after he was inspired by disgraced property spruiker Henry Kaye. Bankruptcy means he can no longer be sued by creditors, but his trustee, Dennis Turner of accounting firm PKF, said he could investigate whether any money had been hidden away in recent years.
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Didaktikon
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113#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31540
Posts:1514
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To Im%5Fout
(Date Posted:07/02/2009 08:19:28)
And the truly sad thing? Simon Longfield and the RCI continues to defend and support this man, as they believe that he's been misrepresented! The he's been the victim of a vendetta!
How does one respond to this sort of delusion?!
Ian
--------------------------------------------------------------
Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Disciple(Ex-member)
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:07/02/2009 16:01:49)
Its deputy leader, Vic Semoilenko, told the flock in December that it
was "sad that people (complaining about Mr Duker) could be so bitter,
and it was sad that people could make so many errors and then want to
blame others for their errors".
And how does Victor Samoilenko justify this sick remark ?? I would be very bitter if someone duped me out of my home and possessions.. I think it sad that so many people have been fooled by VS for so long. Perhaps this explains why his little group in Townsville has the highest rate of membership turnover in the whole RCI..
Disciple
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cultevasion
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115#
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Rank:Member IV
Score:1420
Posts:68
Registered:24/06/2006
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:07/02/2009 16:08:50)
How could the NAB Bank, his own mother and his own company have a vendetta against him? Delusion, delusion, delusion! We all know it is more than that!
With so many other creditors on the list, as well as reputable large Banks and other financiers such as GE Money, Deputy Commissioner of Taxation, Esanda, Westpac, Citibank, Ray White, Origin Energy, BCC, AMEX, ANZ (the list goes on) it is very clear who "has made the errors", what Duker has done and what Longfield has done, and what Samoilenko has done, what ASIC did not do but should have! They need to be held accountable. This was no accident.
--------------------------------------------------------------
cultivation leads to cultevasion -
don"t reap what they sow!
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outaegypt
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116#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:07/02/2009 17:58:41)
Victor and Simon have continuously placed blame on the victims instead of the instigator.
If Simon and Victor can convince people these victims are bitter, they then feel justified in slandering them to further point people in the wrong direction for where the fault lies, to attempt to cover their own wrong doing in involving them selves and the church.
A strong current that has always been picked up from "the bitter Complainants" as Victor called them, is the hope that Glenn would come to the realization of his wrong doings, repent and fix it.
They have felt Dissapointment, devistation and at times Anger, who wouldnt? that would be a more honest discription but not hatred and bitterness as Simon and Victor has encouraged people to beleive.
This family was in the Assembly for about 17 years, as a house leader and from 95 as an Area leader, Simon admitted he tried to find some one to speak against them and he couldn't. Simon told the reporter they wernt regular they didnt come very often. Again another slight on truth.
They did not put their money in business deals and couldn't handle it as Victor said in his talk, the issue is they lent GD money when he begged them for help and Signed Loans for him, he asked them for help as a brother and friend, they asked for 100% personal gaurentees; they were worthless to the banks, they didn't expect to be so viley deceived by their own Pastor, what they can be blaimed for is naivity.
What a wicked web we weave when we practice to deceive.
Lloys always said Cob webs, cob webs-Kill the Spider!
So many lives have been trapped in this web.
--------------------------------------------------------------
As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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Uncoolman
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117#
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Rank:Regular Rookier
Score:5550
Posts:156
Registered:05/04/2003
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RE:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:08/02/2009 01:41:14)
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Disciple(Ex-member)
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Reply To Didaktikon
(Date Posted:08/02/2009 16:40:50)
Reply to Didaktikon (07/02/2009 08:19:28)
And the truly sad thing? Simon Longfield and the RCI continues to defend and support this man, as they believe that he's been misrepresented! The he's been the victim of a vendetta!
How does one respond to this sort of delusion?!
Ian
Locate the Commanding Officer of the local Army Base and get permission to use the said person as target practice on the live firing range. If it's any consolation to you, I have the local Army Howitzer range at Greenbank within 10 mins drive.  And somedays they let off some very noisy firecrackers ..... perhaps you could include Simon's deputy Vic as well - that would make the targets even more harder to miss !!Eric
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Episkopeo
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119#
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Rank:Regular Rookier
Score:5700
Posts:267
Registered:30/08/2007
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Reply To Disciple
(Date Posted:08/02/2009 18:15:35)
Reply to Disciple (08/02/2009 16:40:50) Reply to Didaktikon (07/02/2009 08:19:28)
And the truly sad thing? Simon Longfield and the RCI continues to defend and support this man, as they believe that he's been misrepresented! The he's been the victim of a vendetta!
How does one respond to this sort of delusion?!
Ian Hi Eric,
This (the unwavering support) is so odd and out of character in Rev groups. Normally they very quickly dissocciate themselves from anyone involved in any messy business which might, even hint, at reflecting badly or bringing the church into disrepute. The good name and the good witness being uppermost. If someone has done the wrong thing, usually the church don't want to know them. I haven't been following this that closely, but I can't help wondering if there could have been a much deeper church involvement, of those in power in RCI than meets the eye. Perhaps GD was allowed the privilege of working on behalf of certain silent parties. A sort of, if Hillsong can do it so can RCI, with GD in charge of investments just like Hillsong who use their financial experts in their so far very successful ventures. Later RCI allowing GD to invite others aboard to vainly try to keep afloat the sinking ship. Then, as they do well, turning the blame on to the greed of the people for the loss of their money and homes and adding insult to injury with unkind comments from the front. I know I might sound like Agatha Christie's Miss Marple, but just a few of my own thoughts to try to explain their one eyed support of GD, when others are put out in disgrace for much, much less (a teenager sampling a glass of beer or a lady visiting another church with a friend etc etc.) I can think of three instances of fraud in the church, nowhere near this magnitude, one was workplace fraud, another defrauding church members and a straight out robbery. In each case the accused were shown the door post haste to protect the church's good name. By the time the court cases were heard (in two cases) no-one seemed even to remember these people were ever members of the church. Epi
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Episkopeo
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120#
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Rank:Regular Rookier
Score:5700
Posts:267
Registered:30/08/2007
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:08/02/2009 18:36:26)
Perhaps they are committed to protecting GD and thereby protecting themselves and financial interests of the RCI.
Epi
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outaegypt
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121#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:11/02/2009 22:34:36)
Mr K asked in Chat box about the names crossed out on the Glenn Duker Liquidation notice. These are said to be private individual peoples that have been duped, there are no revival centre people on this liquidation notice. Unless people are trading under an entity which would conceal their name.
M & G Lago, Glenns In-laws are listed as owed $1,453,000.00. There are a lot of creditors not declared that should have been on this list. The final debt will be larger than the $34 Mil Declared.
(Message edited by outaegypt On 11/02/2009 23:41:08)
--------------------------------------------------------------
As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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outaegypt
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122#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:11/02/2009 22:40:29)
Did any one up in Queensland see an Article in the Brisbane Sun- Herald last Sunday 9/02 on the Duker case.
--------------------------------------------------------------
As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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Disciple(Ex-member)
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:11/02/2009 23:10:25)
Reply to outaegypt (11/02/2009 22:40:29)
Did any one up in Queensland see an Article in the Brisbane Sun- Herald last Sunday 9/02 on the Duker case. |
No
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outaegypt
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124#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:11/02/2009 23:28:43)
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/national/expastor-joins-list-of-10-biggest-bankrupts/2009/02/12/1234028166542.html Ex-pastor joins list of 10 biggest bankrupts By Michael Bachelard | February 12, 2009 - 9:51AM
A FORMER fundamentalist church pastor who lost millions of investors' dollars through questionable property deals is one of Australia's worst bankrupts, owing at least $34 million. The total owed by former Gold Coast lawyer Glenn Phillip Duker could hit about $40 million, because some debts he personally guaranteed do not appear on his bankruptcy notification. Insolvency experts say Mr Duker, now of Melbourne, is among the nation's 10 biggest bankrupts in the past decade. Mr Duker is a former pastor with Revival Centres International, which has branches in Queensland. He threw in the financial towel on January 9 after seven years of living a rich life while losing millions of dollars of other people's money. His church, however, has stood by him. Its deputy leader, Vic Semoilenko, said in December it was "sad that people [complaining about Mr Duker] could be so bitter, and it was sad that people could make so many errors and then want to blame others for their errors". Mr Duker has listed his largest creditor as the National Australia Bank's low-doc loan company, Homeloans Ltd, which is reportedly owed $12 million. Homeloans Ltd disputes this exposure. Other commercial lenders are each owed more than $1 million. Mr Duker also owes his mother $1.4 million, and his family's investment company $2 million. Many of the debts were accrued after the Australian Securities and Investments Commission (ASIC) investigated Mr Duker and his former property development company, RVP Group, in 2007. ASIC accepted Mr Duker's promises to repay debts to investors. Some received money back after threatening legal action, but others were left short. One victim, who lives in Victoria, said she had been forced to "sell everything" after Mr Duker reneged on a personal guarantee of $150,000. RVP Group, like most of Mr Duker's companies, is in liquidation. The liquidator believes the company traded while insolvent. Other companies are under the control of his wife, Lorilea. Former Sydney Swans player Craig O'Brien said he had sold a $1.3 million Surfers Paradise home to Mr Duker in mid-2007 but had agreed to lend part of the sale price back to him. Mr O'Brien said he had seen no return and was still owed about $700,000, after the bank had eventually sold the house at a loss to recoup its loan to Mr Duker. Another Queensland victim of the Dukers' scheme, Lynette Orloff, said she had spent $100,000 on legal fees fighting the Dukers and could not afford any more. Asked for comment on the bankruptcy, Mrs Duker said: "I really don't have time at the moment and I'm really not interested." Some of the Queensland victims will discuss possible legal action at a meeting with a Gold Coast lawyer tomorrow. WITH KATE DENNEHY
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As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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Disciple(Ex-member)
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Reply To outaegypt
(Date Posted:12/02/2009 16:18:53)
Reply to outaegypt (11/02/2009 23:28:43) http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/national/expastor-joins-list-of-10-biggest-bankrupts/2009/02/12/1234028166542.html
To those who are current members: It is high time for you to rethink and re-evaluate your continued membership involvement with such an organisation that is obviously not being conducted in a true Christlike way. There is no need to fear the thought of leaving the Revival Centres International and you will certainly find when you take those first steps upon walking out the RCI front door and you decide to "shake the RCI dust from your feet" that God has not abandoned you or forsaken you in any way. In fact you will find God prospering your journey away from the Revival Centres to new levels and newer and higher heights in ways that would not be possible by remaining behind...
blessings
Eric
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outaegypt
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126#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:12/02/2009 20:00:37)
What Disciple has said above is so true, I have been a Dedicated RC Loyal for so many years but what I have come into now with my Relationship with the Lord surpasses any thing I thought I had before. There is an oppression of expectation and control that you don't dare acknowledge whilst within but once you leave and find the Lord in a healthier relationship/environment you realize what a burden of lack luster life you lived with unknowingly for all those years. And don't let any one tell you 'if your relationship with God is lack luster it's your vision thats the problem', it's not -it's the crap diet your being fed, you've been eating the same regulation regurgitated slop for years. Take a moment to be honest at least within yourself. Do you feel on fire, excited,fulfilled, Joyful, free, Spirit led or are you obligated, confined and trapped in a regulated, repetitious cycle, honoring Men that hold position and power that do not reflect the God of the bible. So many are shown to be self seeking and self serving, everything opposite to what the Lord is. These men no longer reflect the Image of Christ. They are tarnish by greed, lies, money and power. I've wasted most of my life serving an institution and giving my loyalty to men- not that I realized at the time. For the later half of my life I want to fully be of use to the the Lord and be about his work in whatever capacity that comes into my life.
Don't stay a caterpillar break out of the cocoon and become a butterfly- the Lord has begun a good work in you but you are bound by a cocoon that will not set you free or develop you to what the Lord would have you become.
Is it easy? No, there's a lot to overcome and sort through.
Will you fall away? Not if you are committed to the Lord of the Bible. God should be your strength not the organization. Will you miss the past life? For sure, there is a grieving. Our past stays with us but our future is ahead. Phil 3:13 Brethren, I do not count myself to have apprehended(understood); but one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead, Will you regret it? Never
Is it Worth it? Hell yes!
Don't be held back any longer from the full potential that God has for your life.
It is like stepping into the light not realizing you've been sitting in the Dark.
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As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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Disciple(Ex-member)
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Reply To outaegypt
(Date Posted:12/02/2009 23:03:34)
Reply to outaegypt (12/02/2009 20:00:37) What Disciple has said above is so true, I have been a Dedicated RC Loyal for so many years but what I have come into now with my Relationship with the Lord surpasses any thing I thought I had before.
My experience of leaving the Revival Centres reminds me of Romans 7 and 8. You can be bound in legalism without the power to do anything about it. But if you have been truly regenerated by the Holy Spirit then Romans 8 comes clearly into the picture and God empowers you to make the choice that you have the Heavenly right to pursue and one totally free with legalism's ugly head totally bruised and crushed under the heels of your feet. God promises you complete victory over any form of legalism including the RCI brand of legalism.
blessings
Eric
ps To the RCI pastors reading this post. This is not an attack on the RCI but rather is a stern rebuke of its sad practices that do not conform to true Biblical Christianity.
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Uncoolman
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128#
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Rank:Regular Rookier
Score:5550
Posts:156
Registered:05/04/2003
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RE:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:05/03/2009 04:39:53)
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Aimoo Team
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:05/03/2009 05:11:33)
This message has been deleted due to Termination of Account.
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Disciple(Ex-member)
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Reply To Uncoolman
(Date Posted:05/03/2009 15:44:42)
Reply to Uncoolman (05/03/2009 04:39:53) A talk given by Victor Samoilenko giving 'his' account of his court visit
What is also strange is his admission that no one sent him to Townsville to start a work and it appears that he is affirming the fact that he is self appointed as a "pastor".
And also when you listen to the recording, the man appears to have no sense of reality  . He really appears lost...
"The Revival Centres International" - there go I but for the grace of God.
blessings
Eric
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Didaktikon
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131#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31540
Posts:1514
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To Disciple
(Date Posted:05/03/2009 16:35:35)
Hi, Eric.
Given that Vic Samoilenko had apparently been making use of Duker's services for his own personal financial benefit, it would hardly do for him to not brush aside concern for/outrage over the matter, eh? Sadly truth often becomes a rather 'rubbery' commodity when one has behaved in a matter that is unbecoming one's position or station in life, and faces public exposure.
Blessings,
Ian
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Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Im_out
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132#
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Registered:02/01/2009
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:06/03/2009 03:22:03)
The hypocrisy is unbelievable, and folk are still being told that not to believe every thing they read in the papers and that its all exaggerated.
I must share this, someone said to me, that THE REVIVAL CENTRES ARE THE EXCLUSIVE BRETHERN OF THE PENTICOSTAL WORLD, I found this really meaningful especially after my sons football match, when in speaking to one of the fathers, about God, Death and the Recession etc, when he told me that he went to an offshoot of the Brethren. I told him about the way RCI was run etc etc etc, he then commented that if we were looking for somewhere to go he reckoned we would fit in ok with them as they were not that bad. Gives you something to think about doesn't it when they say that.
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outaegypt
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133#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:06/03/2009 06:39:50)
Duker recently being named as one of Australia's top 10 Bankruptcies, shows the depth of deception used to be able to Create a $40 Million debt in such a short period of time. Its an opportunity needing to expose the truth of the man and the church that has publicly supported The Dukers and publicly demeaned his victims. (Victors talk posted above) It is said to have developed into such a huge, appalling case.
Makes me think of one of those choruses you never want to here again...... "There's no hiding place down here, there's no hiding place down here. I went to the rock to hide my face, the rock cried out no hiding place, There's no hiding place down here"
(Message edited by outaegypt On 12/03/2009 21:55:59)
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As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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CAGD
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134#
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Registered:21/01/2009
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:06/03/2009 07:49:09)
Hopefully through exposure, accountability will take place for those that are suppose to be shepherds but have acted like wolves.
Proverbs 21:6 6. Getting treasures by a lying tongue Is the fleeting fantasy of those who seek death. 7. The violence of the wicked will destroy them because they refuse to do justice.
(Message edited by CAGD On 06/03/2009 07:51:07)
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Im_out
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135#
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Registered:02/01/2009
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:06/03/2009 12:48:29)
A few more, James 5 1Now listen, you rich people, weep and wail because of the misery that is coming upon you. 2 Peter 2:3 3In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping. Micah 6:11 11 Shall I acquit a man with dishonest scales, with a bag of false weights? Hosea 12:7 7 The merchant uses dishonest scales; he loves to defraud. Proverbs 22:1
A good name is more desirable than great riches; to be esteemed is better than silver or gold. 1 Timothy 6:10
For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people, eager for money, have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs. Psalm 101:7
No one who practices deceit will dwell in my house; no one who speaks falsely will stand in my presence. 2 Corinthians 11:12-14 12And I will keep on doing what I am doing in order to cut the ground from under those who want an opportunity to be considered equal with us in the things they boast about. 13For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ. 14And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.
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outaegypt
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136#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:09/03/2009 09:16:16)
Will confirm precisely if I hear anything.
Programs usually start they're advertising a day or two earlier and refer to what's on the next show at the prior programs end.
(Message edited by outaegypt On 12/03/2009 21:48:11)
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As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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Im_out
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137#
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Registered:02/01/2009
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Reply To outaegypt
(Date Posted:09/03/2009 12:51:41)
Reply to outaegypt (09/03/2009 09:16:16)
The program is A Current Affair, ACA, channel 9, 7pm(?) possibly Thursday 12 or Friday 13 this week.
This is the first of a possible four on the Duker disaster.
Will confirm precisely if I hear anything.
Programs usually start they're advertising a day or two earlier and refer to what's on the next show at the prior programs end. Hi Outa heres the web link to the above program, http://aca.ninemsn.com.au/I looked under the "Special Investigations" Tab but nothing yet, and in Melbourne its on 630pm Im_Out
(Message edited by Im_out On 09/03/2009 12:54:42)
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Didaktikon
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138#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31540
Posts:1514
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To outaegypt
(Date Posted:09/03/2009 17:31:51)
Good morning, OoE.
It would be something of a pity should ACA cover the Duker affair. They're about as credible with respect to journalism as is the RCI with respect to Christian theology!
Blessings,
Ian
(Message edited by Didaktikon On 09/03/2009 17:35:14)
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Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Didaktikon
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139#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31540
Posts:1514
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To CAGD
(Date Posted:10/03/2009 00:26:59)
Hi, CAGD.
Okay then. If the journalists presenting the story are competent and ethical, all should be well. I will admit to being thoroughly amazed that Simon Longfield continues pretending that nothing untoward has happened! Perhaps it's the case that he naively imagines the entire affair will simply 'blow-over' in due course? That all will eventually be forgotten? Regardless, I do wonder whether the senior pastor comprehends the extent of the damage that the Duker scandal will have upon the Revival Centres International, and what remains of its 'reputation'? Perhaps it's simply the case that his advisers haven't been doing their jobs properly. Well, those advisers who aren't personally entangled in the affair, themselves, anyway.
Ask yourself this, Simon: how many Mr and Mrs Average Australian haven't heard of the Exclusive Brethren? Such is the reach of the popular media. Now Brother Duker has opened the 'Pandora's Box' of your family's devising, but I doubt that 'hope' will be the last little pixie to exit it in this instance.
Blessings,
Ian
(Message edited by Didaktikon On 10/03/2009 01:27:30)
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Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Im_out
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140#
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Registered:02/01/2009
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:10/03/2009 06:16:21)
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Talmid
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141#
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Rank:Regular Member
Score:4190
Posts:205
Registered:21/04/2008
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:10/03/2009 15:04:34)
It'll be interesting to see what editorial policy and the ACA demographic leave from the journalists' work. (Maybe Batchelard will need to write a book.) Let's hope the "mums and dads" at least get a kind ATO ruling on the matter, if they haven't received that already.
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There are 10 kinds of people in the world: those who understand binary and those who don't.
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Episkopeo
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142#
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Rank:Regular Rookier
Score:5700
Posts:267
Registered:30/08/2007
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:10/03/2009 21:39:26)
Let's hope this report puts paid to the cover up, and playing down of the situation currently going on in the organisation and really opens folks eyes
I'm_Out
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Hi I'm_Out,
Listening to Victor Samalenko's talk (from above link) was an example of playing down a situation, like when leaders just HAVE to address a problem to allay fears of the flock thinking for themselves and drawing their own conclusions. I've heard better than Victor's attempt, he sounded very uncomfortable, but the situation was particularly sticky. It nevertheless has a familiar ring to it, the methods used were typical and of similar vein to others I've heard. For RCIers viewing, it was as usual full of the skillful use of the power of suggestion.
Interspersed throughout Victor's account of his "exciting" experience of "finding himself in court" was the positives of the good witness of "my story" enabling him to "stand up and say what we (RCI) stand for."
The newspaper articles; well, they were "99% wrong and just sad, so sad, that people could be so bitter, really sad. People make errors and blame other people, but that's life, these things happen and it's just so sad.
Now the positive is that whatever happens, "if we are pumped up in the things of God and the Holy Ghost we can handle these things, we are well able. Our foundation is not mammon, our foundation is the Holy Ghost and if we are built up in God's Holy Ghost we can walk through the fire and not get burnt."
Well, lets see if the RCI can walk through the fire or as Victor said (ride out) the "tsunami of change."
God Bless
Epi
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Didaktikon
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143#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31540
Posts:1514
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To Episkopeo
(Date Posted:10/03/2009 22:11:40)
Hi, Epi.
How interesting that Vic Samoilenko has chosen to vilify the victims, and lionise the villains! From what I've heard Vic, who has a well-deserved reputation for engaging in profitable business schemings, oops, I meant 'schemes', made use of Duker's services. But he was apparently one of the select few who didn't lose on the deal. Now why would that be, do you think?
Having listened to his 'apology' for the entire sordid affair I'm left thinking: now there's a man with a pastor's heart for people!
Blessings,
Ian
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Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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CAGD
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144#
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Registered:21/01/2009
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:11/03/2009 08:04:28)
Good Evening everyone, just heard that the investigative report on Glenn Duker may be airing next Monday Night (16th) that would give it a 3 day lead up.
(Message edited by CAGD On 12/03/2009 21:40:36)
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Im_out
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145#
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Registered:02/01/2009
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Reply To CAGD
(Date Posted:11/03/2009 11:55:22)
Reply to CAGD (11/03/2009 08:04:28)
Good Evening everyone, just heard that the ACA investigative report on Glenn Duker will be airing next Monday Night (16th) the advertising will run from Friday giving it a 3 day lead up.
Excellent, your probably find the footage will be put up under Special Investigation tab on the aca site
http://aca.ninemsn.com.au/investigations/ or under the Video Tab http://video.msn.com/?mkt=en-au&brand=ninemsn&;tab=m164 I'm sure someone will get this up then.
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Didaktikon
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146#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31540
Posts:1514
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To CAGD
(Date Posted:11/03/2009 15:20:00)
Good morning, CAGD.
And so it begins! Perhaps once the program has aired Simon Longfield and his senior leadership will accept their error in their handling of this sordid affair, they will repent of their shared culpability, and then publicly apologise to all whom they have hurt? Perhaps, but I shan't be holding my breath. Everything that's happened to date points to the probability of them blaming others (yet again).
If I may requote St Jerome: "flee with great haste from the man of God who is also a man of business!"
Blessings,
Ian
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Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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outaegypt
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147#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Reply To Didaktikon
(Date Posted:11/03/2009 17:21:04)
Reply to Didaktikon (11/03/2009 15:20:00) Perhaps Simon Longfield and his senior leadership will accept their error in their handling of this sordid affair, they will repent of their shared culpability, and then publicly apologise to all whom they have hurt?
Your so funny!!!!  or is that the drugs talking?
OoE
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As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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outaegypt
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148#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:11/03/2009 18:41:45)
Reply to Epi : RE RECORDED TALK
Victor: just sad, so sad, that people could be so bitter, really sad.
What's sad is the lack of discernment or recognition of God in people, the people he speaks of still pray that Glenn and the Pastors involved come to a place of repentance for their Salvation's sake not just over this affair but the entire lie that their existence is to the people who they rule over.... With the things they have endured I doubt I'd be as concerned given the same circumstances. These are really corrupt evil men.
Victor: People make errors and blame other people...Yes exactly what Glenn Duker has done with Victor and Simons assistance. Although as the ATO pointed out the errors were continual with out correction and inexcusable for a Solicitor(Glenn) and executed knowingly.
Simon claims his concern was to protect the integrity of the church but he was told - this would blow up and If he got involved the church would be directly implicated, more so than what it already was with 7 Pastors involved and 3 Pastors being Directors of the fraudulent company. To shift their own guilty involvement from being scrutinized the Pastors attempt to silence the whistle blowers and demonize them, all in a vain attempt to cover up the truth.
Consequently it hasn't worked and will now highlight in digital high definition the injustices of ALL their actions for ALL to see not just God..
Victor: but that's life, these things happen. $40 Million Dollars of Debt accumulated in 3 years with no assets to show for it, doesnt just happen that takes planning, pages and pages and pages of Creditors- families losing their homes,lies and deception, hiding from the Mob and bikies, threats, property being vandalized, these things dont just happen of their own accord this is not 'life' happening- appears more like Criminal totally unrepentant behavior.
How disgusting that the Pastors still refuse to admit their fault and publicly blame the victims in support of Duker.
The shame they should feel would cripple an honest man with guilt to death- but I suppose that's the point.
(Message edited by outaegypt On 12/03/2009 21:30:52)
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As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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Episkopeo
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149#
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Rank:Regular Rookier
Score:5700
Posts:267
Registered:30/08/2007
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:11/03/2009 19:16:42)
Hi Outaegypt,
They (RCI leaders) should never again, as they've done of old, refer to the leaders of other churches (Catholic, Anglican etc) as :-
"Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron: 1 Timothy 4 : 2. Epi
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Episkopeo
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150#
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Rank:Regular Rookier
Score:5700
Posts:267
Registered:30/08/2007
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Re:Rci pastor has been uncovered
(Date Posted:11/03/2009 19:30:46)
Reply to CAGD (11/03/2009 08:04:28)
Good Evening everyone, just heard that the ACA investigative report on Glenn Duker will be airing next Monday Night (16th) the advertising will run from Friday giving it a 3 day lead up. If advertising will run for 3 days from Friday, I'm wondering what Friday and Sunday meetings will bring forth, if anything. Perhaps they'll completely ignore it as "enough said, now time to get on with our walk" or perhaps they'll take the hard approach of "anathema to any of the flock who watch." Whatever the approach, I think it's time the flock became assertive.
God Bless
Epi
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