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Disciple(Ex-member)
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Reply To D%2DT%2DM
(Date Posted:15/02/2009 22:30:01)
Reply to D-T-M (15/02/2009 19:34:19)
Simon said:
We are not going to give money as the civil authorities are doing that but here is a brand new bible for each family.
Hi DTM But if the boot was on the other foot there would be an Assembly wide love offering taken up... How thoughtful of Simon ?? blessings Disciple
(Message edited by Disciple On 15/02/2009 22:31:02)
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Im_out
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2#
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Registered:02/01/2009
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Re:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:16/02/2009 02:29:26)
Out Side the front of Boxhill RCI there is a big sign that says
THE CHURCH THAT CARES,
I could really go to town on this but I am a spirit filled Christian, and its best I don’t or else folk will judge me as sick and as hypocritical as those within the organisation that make the rules. My praises go to the house meeting that dared to stand up against the establishment. Did Box hill open its doors to the public to drop off donated goods,?? , Sort them and send them off to agencies responsible for there distribution, Think if you did, how many folk would come through the doors and hear and know about you and eventually come into the meeting, A great opportunity missed in your hardness of hearts, But then knowing what we all know now about RCI and the deep rooted hypocrisy within in its ability to make sound judgments maybe it was best you were not involved.
Can I ask, those tragically affected by this disaster, have they received affective counselling from caring compassionate oversight?? or are they just told to “go and witness to 10 people so that then the problem would disappear” or as was common, if you have a problem then “Just pray about brother, sister” Those who don’t cope or have problems are seen as not being spiritual enough, so what you have here is an organisation that on Sunday appears in a very good, peachy, super fantastic and holy and yet the rest of the time some are crying, some are hurt some are dismayed. Yet there just told to “pray about it” O yes and as DTM, said, they are expected to come up on stage and give a testimony about it, even though the whole tragic event has probably not sunk in yet.
I’m sorry Ill get off my soap box now, but this post got right under my skin, and thank you DTM for sharing with us, (I think you could do so much good outside in a caring compassionate organisation, I think you'd be a real champion there :) ) having been directly involved in the relief effort, the church I’m in, (a spirit filled tongue talking church!!!!) worked 16 hrs a day with everyone to ensure effected folk were taken care off, (and nobody was made to volunteer but because of the love and compassion that there naturally exists there, folk WANTED to, most took annual leave, sick leave, with there companies supporting them) and those in our assembly received, food, clothing, everything you can imagine. (and bibles !!!) The things we have heard and seen I cannot bring my self to write on this site !!! Cherish those and look after and those with love who were affected,
I have finished now but here are some scriptures for you consideration:
1Ti 5:8 But if anyone does not provide for his own, and especially for those of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.
Jas 2:14 What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can that faith save him?
Jas 2:15 If a brother or sister is without clothing and in need of daily food,
Jas 2:16 and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, be warmed and be filled," and yet you do not give them what is necessary for their body, what use is that?
1Co 13:1 If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but do not have love, I have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal.
(Message edited by Im_out On 16/02/2009 16:02:08)
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Didaktikon
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3#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31600
Posts:1517
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To Im%5Fout
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 01:21:03)
Hello, 'Out'.
Much of what you shared was laudable; however, you also stated: "...the church I’m in, (a spirit filled tongue talking church!!!!)..." as if such were actually a good thing. To begin with, the terms 'Spirit-filled' and 'church' are actually tautologies: each expression accurately describes the other (there can be no such animal as a non 'Spirit-filled' church). Second the inference that you intended by the term 'Spirit-filled' is actually a nonsense at best, and incredibly arrogant at worst. Do you honestly believe there are 'degrees' of Christians? The 'spiritual' ones that can gibber away in 'tongues', and the 'garden-pot-variety' that can't? If so, then you are no better than a gnostic! And finally, what are we to think of your "tongue talking church"? Is there such a thing? Paul clearly teaches us in 1 Corinthians 12 through 14 that the answer is, in fact, a resounding 'no'.
I hope and pray that you'll reflect on the above points.
Blessings,
Ian
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Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Didaktikon
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4#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31600
Posts:1517
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To D%2DT%2DM
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 01:28:57)
Hi, Mole.
Five or six RCI families homes were burnt out, fortunately without loss of life or injury. Another family experienced what even the cynical Mole accepts as a miracle having the only house not destroyed in their street.
Simon said: We are not going to give money as the civil authorities are doing that but here is a brand new bible for each family.
Wow. That was truly 'big' of him: "so sorry that you lost your home and everything that you own, but here, have free Bible, that'll make you feel better!" I'm awed by the man's compassion! Anyway, I'm betting the Bibles that he so graciously and thoughtfully distributed were 'cheapies' as well.
Figures...
Blessings,
Ian
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Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Aimoo Team
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Re:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 02:40:14)
This message has been deleted due to Termination of Account.
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TELLMETRUTH
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6#
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Rank:Lurker
Score:240
Posts:12
Registered:21/10/2008
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RE:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 06:22:55)
We are not going to give money as the civil authorities are doing that but here is a brand new bible for each family.
Why don't you tell the WHOLE story, what he actually said Mole? I guess that is your job on here - half truths.
This is quite funny to watch... Keep going.
(Message edited by TELLMETRUTH On 17/02/2009 06:29:44)
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Disciple(Ex-member)
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RE:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 15:48:51)
Perhaps we should send Simon a copy of Dr Gordon Fee's "How to read the Bible for all its Worth" in recognition of his generosity !!
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Didaktikon
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8#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31600
Posts:1517
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To TELLMETRUTH
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 15:55:39)
Good morning, TMT.
If you believe the "Mole's" account to be less than full-orbed, then perhaps you might go to the effort of educating us all concerning the true extent of the RCI's charity with regards to the recent Victorian bushfires?
Blessings,
Ian
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Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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TELLMETRUTH
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9#
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Rank:Lurker
Score:240
Posts:12
Registered:21/10/2008
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RE:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 16:30:17)
The 8th - It was originally asked if any one could help physically and with trailers and such, and getting phone # together for when it was clear, for people to start moving in to help out with what ever was needed. The 15th was suggested instead of just donating anything and everything - it might be more appropriate to have the people who had lost in the fires - some sort of register of things lost. Then people can buy specific items for them rather than have a lot of random gear they need to sort through. And of course...... Yes the Bibles would be in thrown in also as a passing light hearted comment. Thought this was a good idea.
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Didaktikon
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10#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31600
Posts:1517
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To TELLMETRUTH
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 16:40:56)
Hi, TMT.
Thanks for the additional info, and for helping to clear this up a bit.
The 8th - It was originally asked if any one could help physically and with trailers and such, and getting phone # together for when it was clear, for people to start moving in to help out with what ever was needed.
Very appropriate. So what's happened thus far?
The 15th was suggested instead of just donating anything and everything - it might be more appropriate to have the people who had lost in the fires - some sort of register of things lost. Then people can buy specific items for them rather than have a lot of random gear they need to sort through.
Excellent! It's pleasing to learn that the people are being encouraged to 'dig deep' at this time. But what of the organisation itself? Does the RCI intend to dip into its coffers to assist people with rebuilding their lives?
And of course...... Yes the Bibles would be in thrown in also as a passing light hearted comment.
Okay, but I wonder if the sentiment was (a) appropriate, or (b) received in the same 'light-hearted' fashion in which it was delivered? Anyway, this aside, might I ask what the RCI is doing, or intends doing, to assist all those non-RCI people whose lives were directly affected by the bushfires? As the sign says, "The Church That Cares" and all.
Blessings,
Ian
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Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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Aimoo Team
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Re:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 16:57:39)
This message has been deleted due to Termination of Account.
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Sea Urchin
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12#
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Rank:Poster Venti III
Score:9010
Posts:431
Registered:15/02/2007
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Re:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 21:03:53)
Just a little question TMT - did the RCI donate to and help out ALL victims of the fires or only the actual RCI members?
During the last week 14 semi-trailers full of aid has been driven to Victoria from an Adelaide community church with one man organsing it. The same church also donated 10% of their 'offerings' from all Sunday services on top of the usual 10% that goes to the Salvos anyway. Another large church in Sydney has given 10% from Sunday services also plus the full amount received at a Leaders Conference.
This is what is meant by 'helping' - we can't just help those of 'our' church, Jesus didn't call us to love one another and then add in brackets 'but only if they're in the same church as you'. We're told to love one another as He loves us - and He loves us unconditionally.
Urch
(Message edited by Sea Urchin On 17/02/2009 21:06:55)
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TELLMETRUTH
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13#
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Rank:Lurker
Score:240
Posts:12
Registered:21/10/2008
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RE:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 22:53:42)
When I was in RCI, I was also a volunteer in SES and was told to leave it as there where plenty of "outsiders" that would do the job. Duh!!
Well a few members are CFA volunteers and were fighting the fires over this time.......  As with everyone ells in the community, people are giving and supporting where they can. As for RCI the organization, I haven't heard.... and I'm not particularly worried about it. I suppose stones could be thrown at others also. I'm more interested in individual concern for others at this time.... and that includes oversight. Rather than an outward show of.... look how much RCI can give. And to be honest, if RCI has given massive amounts of money etc... would it be enough for you all.... I'd doubt it.
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Didaktikon
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14#
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Rank:Old Forum Fogey
Score:31600
Posts:1517
Registered:29/08/2007
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Reply To TELLMETRUTH
(Date Posted:17/02/2009 23:18:09)
Hi, TMT.
I think that some of the people here, former members mind, are simply attempting to work out whether or not the RCI has broken with its long-standing practice of remaining aloof from the needs of the wider community.
Blessings,
Ian
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Vivos voco, mortuos plango
website: www.pleaseconsider.info email: didaktikon@gmail.com
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outaegypt
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15#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Re:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:18/02/2009 02:54:09)
An arm around someone's shoulder can be worth more than any money given or material possession in times of such distressing devastation. It really is irrelevant what the RC organisation does, this is one situation where size doesn't matter. It's about the genuine compassion of love and concern to your fellow man, not just your brothers and sisters in your particular organization. Is the gift given in response to the worthiness of the receiver or in relation to the worth of the giver? For myself I feel better to ask what can I do than worry about what someone else is or isn't doing. Rci will never be a yard stick worth gauging anything of good measure against.
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As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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TELLMETRUTH
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16#
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Rank:Lurker
Score:240
Posts:12
Registered:21/10/2008
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RE:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:18/02/2009 05:14:31)
An arm around someone's shoulder can be worth more than any money given or material possession in times of such distressing devastation. It really is irrelevant what the RC organisation does, this is one situation where size doesn't matter. It's about the genuine compassion of love and concern to your fellow man, not just your brothers and sisters in your particular organization. Is the gift given in response to the worthiness of the receiver or in relation to the worth of the giver? For myself I feel better to ask what can I do than worry about what someone else is or isn't doing.
Completely agree.
Rci will never be a yard stick worth gauging anything of good measure against.
And neither will anyone ells for that matter.....
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D-T-M
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17#
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Rank:Rookier II
Score:1830
Posts:75
Registered:28/08/2006
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RE:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:19/02/2009 19:33:30)
For the benefit of TMT The Mole is not a member of RCI and merely reports what Mrs Mole tells his on Sunday nights.
To restate however Mrs Mole who usually will not accept any criticism of Simon and the other pastors concluded that Simon is unwilling to have RCI as a church participate in any form of bushfire relief.
Mrs Mole understands that the purpose of the register of household items to be replaced is not dissimilar to the wedding present list that some people circulate and that individual RCI members could donate specific items should they so desire but the church itself would not be making any contributions.
The Mole was aware of the trailers and chainsaws request but did not bother to mention it because he believed that it would not come to fruition as there would be no public access to the fire areas for weeks to come.
The Mole thanks all CFA volunteers including RCI members for the magnificent work that they have done.
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teeeej
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18#
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Registered:21/02/2009
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Re:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:21/02/2009 18:32:19)
"Simon said:
We are not going to give money as the civil authorities are doing that but here is a brand new bible for each family"
Hmmm DTM I am thinking you should actualy tell the people what Simon realy said.
Simon said we will not as an assembly donate money as many have already individualy done that and other causes are doing that also, we will set up a gift registry at myers for people of the assembly to list things they will need so people can buy them things they will actualy be needing. Now that looks a little less heartless than the tripe you trying to pass off as the truth please tell full truths not half truths , I know leaving out some of it made the story sound better for the people here who like nothing better than to run down Gods people, but please do tell the truth there is no salvation for liars and nay sayers remember God doesnt like liars.
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teeeej
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19#
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Registered:21/02/2009
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Re:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:21/02/2009 18:48:20)
hmmmm Ok this has already been posted and i missed the post sorry about that , so no there will be no need to get on my back about it now Ian :P , I have gone and cleaned my glasses so can look more carefully in Future.
I must mention though that hearsay needs to stay where it started and only first hand accounts of things real should find there way here, after all arent we all about telling the truth no place in the kingdom of God for liars.
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Talmid
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20#
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Rank:Regular Member
Score:4190
Posts:205
Registered:21/04/2008
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Re:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:21/02/2009 22:58:44)
So Teeeej ...
You're confirming DTM's assertion that RCI Melb are not going to give any money?
Have you thought about what might have happened if "the bag" had been passed around a second time with the proviso that the money would all go to the Red Cross appeal? It would have been a good testimony, eh.
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There are 10 kinds of people in the world: those who understand binary and those who don't.
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Im_out
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21#
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Registered:02/01/2009
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Re:Bushfire relief RCI style
(Date Posted:22/02/2009 00:32:59)
I must mention though that hearsay needs to stay where it started and only first hand accounts of things real should find there way here, after all arent we all about telling the truth no place in the kingdom of God for liars.
And Revivalists know all about telling the truth do they ??? I thought they had become experts in cover up and deception, and making one rule for some and one rule for others (Opps sorry I'm writing this on the wrong thread) !!!!
(Message edited by Im_out On 22/02/2009 00:35:05)
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outaegypt
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22#
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Rank:Poster Venti I
Score:6410
Posts:304
Registered:22/06/2006
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Reply To Im%5Fout
(Date Posted:22/02/2009 08:34:13)
Reply to Im_out (22/02/2009 00:32:59) after all arent we all about telling the truth no place in the kingdom of God for liars. So it looks like there's a few spare spots opened up in the old kingdom with that bit of news.And Revivalists know all about telling the truth do they ??? I thought they had become experts in cover up and deception, and making one rule for some and one rule for others (Opps sorry I'm writing this on the wrong thread) !!!! How can Simon give money from the Assembly when he 'allegedly' hasnt paid back the remaining $30,000 of the $50,000 he personally borrowed from the Sydney assembly, (are the Sydney members aware of where their tithes went?) when asked about the outstanding loan it was said to be unquestionably 'suggested' it be writen off as a donation to the Mission fund. Mission fund ... the Black hole Mission fund that would be looked after by Vic Samoilenko. Nothing quite like creative accounting between friends -oh but hang on, they dont keep accounts do they? That might be a clear indication as to why!
It might be nice for them to set up a gift register for those that have been devastated by the Duker disaster. Duker may have lit the Match but Simont fanned the flames and has allowed it to smolder, instead of 'putting it out' when he was given the opportunity years ago... Ooops!s as Epi said 'wrong thread' but they all intwine and weave together so nicely to create a rich tapestry with a very clear picture and it aint nothing to do with Jesus. It's self serving, self seeking, self indulgent and self prevaricating.
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As I hear it, I'll repeat it,
Its up to you if you believe it!
Allegation big and small,
soon revealed before us all.
outa here- Outa Egypt!
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